This is the propaganda I can get behind.
And with trolleybuses powered on a renewable grid, it’s zero gallons!
Or maybe tell bosses that if your job can be done remotely it should be done remotely. Then there’s more room on the bus for people who need to be in meatspace to do their jobs.
Yeah, tell it my boss. I had this conversation today with her.
If only bosses were open to persuasion.
We used to have trolleybuses when I was a kid in the 70’s, they were so insanely much more nice to ride than a diesel. No bad smell, and they were smooth and quiet.
I guess we will get back to something similar soon, but with batteries.
It’s still a shame because the batteries are less environmentally friendly than the old trolley busses.
Yes in some aspects, it’s like we are moving backwards. Funny since the talk about environment is more serious now than back then, still we often use unnecessarily polluting solutions, where the older “too expensive” solutions were viable when we had way less money as a country than we have now?
One would have thought the oil crisis had made us keep the trolley busses?
While I agree with the comparison in the post, the trolleybus powered by renewable energy shouldn’t be compared to gas cars.
It should be compared to electric cars powered by renewable energy.
I disagree, the bus is still replacing the purpose of the gas cars. The bus should just be compared to both gas and electric cars.
It is easier and cheaper to make one larger electric vehicle than 68 smaller ones, and they would damage the road less too. Of course this kind of comparison between two different things is inherently very difficult to do fairly
Trolleybuses are much lighter, cheaper and reliable than regular electric bus or car. Also: a car is still a car.
Ik that ttolleybuses are better than electric cars in carbon footprint, traffic, etc. I’m just proposing that we compare things with the same power source together. It makes more impact to say that an electric trolley is x% better on y metric compared to electric cars, than to say they are x% better than gas cars.
Imagine a situation where you say electric trolleybuses are superior to gas cars for reasons x, y, and z on xcretion or speddit. Then some elon musk bootlicker or big oil bootlicker replies to you saying “what about electric cars” or “what about gas buses”? You craft a meticulous reply about why gas buses are better than electric cars. But it’s too late. Thousands of lurkers saw the bootlicker’s reply to you but will never see your rebuttal. Many of them are now more against public transportation.
How are buses still not better? The ratio of individual people being moved to total mass being moved is better. The maintenance and insurance fees are collective. The driver of the bus is a trained professional vs some rando commuter.
Trolleybuses are great. Fuck Sobyanin.
New electric buses in London are fucking amazing, no need for trolleys.
Until in 5-10 years when the batteries are fucked.
That’s the beautiful thing about trolley buses - they do not need a (substantial) battery. They are basically trains on wheels.
There are some places where battery powered buses make sense - for example, where I live, lucerne Switzerland, there is one bus line that just goes up and down a rather steep hill. By using recuperative braking, the battery powered bus is super efficient. For other, normal ‘high traffic’ lines, trolley makes so much more sense
Trolleys don’t really make any sense. I come from Riga, it has a lot of trolleys and the city is designed around trolleys and trams. And yet modern trolleys have bloody diesel engines, because being permanently hooked to the wire makes no sense at all. It’s much better to have electric buses with a few overhead wires here and there to fast charge on the go.
Lucerne has a few trolley lines. They are ONLY trolley buses. The long, 3 Segment ones. Then, some 1 Segment hybrid buses that have pantagraphs. At the end of those lines, there is a longer stop where the trolley lines end, the pantagraph gets pulled down and the bus trucks along the last few stations with diesel.
Then theres just normal hybrid buses for more rural lines, and a battery operated bus that goes up and down a hill.
There’s a solution for every line - you just need the proper infrastructure. The reason that we have this great pantagraph-compatible infrastructure is that, while there are a lot of trains in Switzerland, there is no metro. So in lucerne, the trolley buses work almost as a metro, with the main lines having buses every 7 minutes.
… why not have as many cables as possible so you can simply minimize battery size? Trolleybuses are just more efficient battery buses.
Cables are expensive and dangerous. Why have them at all?
Batteries are also expensive, and how are cables dangerous? We use them for trams without issue.
People die from touching cables quite regularly.
VPN uses 0 gallons.
Acktually, to use a VPN, you would need to turn on your PC or phone, which uses a small but existent amount of petrol -🤓
Solar power. Checkmate, atheists.
and EV car. also fuck petrol. and gallons while I’m here.
EVs solve about 2 of the 20 problems cars create.
While that’s true, they “solve”* the two issues that are most pressing with ICE cars, air polution and fossil fuel use. I’d rather have EVs over ICEs, and I’d rather have walkable cities and robust public transit than either of the car options.
* are better, not perfect
perfect is the enemy of good.
Hydroelectricity, nuclear, wind and solar BABEEYYYYYY!!!
Hydro destroys environments, uses enormous amounts of concrete and the related disasters have killed orders of magnitude more people than nuclear.
Yeah if three gorges broke then it would be the biggest mass death event in human history. Hydro dams are at the bottom of my list
Orders of magnitude more than nuclear is a low bar, nuclear is quite safe. How does it compare to coal or oil?
perfectly valid point to bring up on a community dedicated to hating on polluters even if it was originally just a joke. Pretty serious matters
Very hard to deliver milk over VPN
When was the last time you saw a milkman on a bus?
That was, of course, just a random example of a job that cannot be done from home. A lot of jobs do require physical presence of people, that’s all I was trying to say.
Of course, a milkman would also require to travel to and fro their place of work, dunno why they cannot be on a bus for that.
You do not actually see many milkmen these days. A milkman’s business was ran a bit like McDonalds’s with the milkman buying the as an individual and then selling it door to door. Every single milkman that I have known has worked from home.
So kind of a bad example but I get your point. No not all people can work from home, but those who can should surely be given that option. I have a wife who is a civil servant. She is required to travel to work for 40% of her hours worked. This is for no other reason than going into work by direction of the Tory party. This was not really an issue until they moved the place of work 8 miles away. She literally has to pay for a bus, sit on a bus for an hour each way, while carrying all her PC equipment with her, just so she can do exactly the same job while sitting in an office. All her meetings are done online, even while in the office. So there is a lot to be said regarding this Tory agenda of forcing people to work from the office just to appease their Donors.
68 men plus the driver makes 69, amirite?
But the driver is already at work
But how does the bus driver get to work?
- Dormitory day before morning shift
- Example: Moscow metro, national railway
- Night shift
- Example: major city, national railway
- PMV
- Example: a city
- Car
- Example: shithole without public transit
To be fair 1 person using car is not 450 people that could use a car. To be fair at most 20% of people have a car in heavily car-centric cities. In good cities it hangs in single-digit.
That made me laugh out loud in the literal sense of the phrase
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Ah, you should see buses in my city. Dirty, thirty years old, overpopulated graves on wheels with no air conditioners.
Never again.
Thirty years old is a perfectly reasonable age for a big chunk of a city’s fleet. You’re still talking kneeling busses.
with no air conditioners.
Dear Faust. Are they using Soviet minibuses?
Ha! I have nothing but good memories about PAZ-3205. Fast, comfortable, with working AC.
LIAZ-677, on the other hand… now that’s a proper torture machine
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cb/LiAZ-677_bus_in_Bor.jpg
LIAZ-677, on the other hand… now that’s a proper torture machine
Whoa! Bus from 60-ies!
Then start campaigning for better public infrastructure.
That one bus company in the nearby city that absolutely refuses to replace their miserable old buses 🥴🤡 while the others run modern air conditioned hybrids, and some fully electric
Recently visited York (UK) and they have a fantastic bus system - and they’re electric.
Busses in my city are also going electric. So far only the local routes. The longer distance routes are still diesel
Despite having the tube and double-decker busses, London is the most traffic congested city in the world.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-01-10/these-are-the-world-s-most-congested-cities
Imagine how bad it would be without the tube and busses! All these people trying to drive in London? Just thinking about it I shudder and I’ve never even seen London.
Good job they have them, in that case!
According to a study conducted in 1000 cities in 50 countries based on data from connected vehicles and phones. Not disagreeing with the premise but I expect there are plenty of other more “congested” cities, visit Manila or Jakarta for example. The UK should however definitely do more to fund its public infrastructure.
London has one of the best transport system in the country.
Manila is hell
Not all sources agree on that. Also, I can think of a way or two to eliminate all traffic congestion.
I was in London for a few days last year and it was pretty fine
At least in my experience most of the traffic is people trying to go into London from commuter towns, and they’ll take the motorways not the streets
But that’ll take away people’s freedom to pay a subscription for heated seats 😔
But everybody loves cars! Just look at how many cars people buy all the time!
/s
I could take 68 men. That’s a normal Saturday night for me.
…in a fight right?
Uuuhhhh…
Can’t take any more, because at 69 you’ll blow a rod.
And not in a good way either…
Gallons? Shouldn’t it be liters?
Shamelessly stolen from I can’t remember.
The only issue I have with this is there’s a British gallon (that is DIFFERENT from the American gallon) that is used to measure milk. :D. That was the only place I saw gallon being used.
Oh no, so we have metric, imperial units, and now colonial units?!
Still british units :D. In 1826 Britain decided to redefine gallon to mean “10 pounds of water”. The earlier standard was 231 cublic inches (potentially meant to be 8 pounds of water). The US never adopted the new gallon.
Brits use tons and tonnes as separate units? Not confusing at all
When I think tonne, I think 1000kg. When I think ton, I just think of the vernacular “tons of stuff” type expression.
I mean there is have metric ton, british ton and american ton. Or tonne. Idk, its all the same in our language.
Actually, as much as I dislike imperial units, when it comes to body temperature I do think in Fahrenheit. Mostly because that’s how my mum would tell if we were too sick to go to school. 99 - just a little ill, but you can have the day off. 100 - pretty ill, probably at least 3 days off. 101+ - super mega ill, off all week.
I believe England, GB maybe, is very much a mixed bag when it comes to measurement standards.
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in miles per gallon
The thing is gallons are different.
For some reason I think, driving distance is kilometers, while driving speed is miles per hour. Is that right?
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If you read the Highway Code, you’ll learn that it’s all over the place. Long distances on signs are in miles. But distance markers are placed in metres. But emergency phones are placed every mile. And distance markers, which are placed in metres and indicate distances in meters can also have a distance to the next emergency phone in fucking yards. One sign, two numbers, no letters, two systems. FUCKING HELL!!!
At least when I was there circa 2006, distances were miles as well.
It’s Bri’ish, innit
It’s not a modern poster
It’s not a modern idea either
Reminds me article name from USSR newspaper about plane crash: “Gallons let down”/“Подвели галлоны”.
It would be nowadays, but this is an old old advert.
but this isn’t new technology where you can write a 100 bullshit news article about and prais it as the next big thing because it actually works and is efficient
Now consider an electric bus
Now consider a trolley.
Are there multiple tracks?
Well, there’s two. Only problem is the often obstructions and questionable breaking system
It makes a good point but only if your country actually has public transport.
If you live somewhere with zero public transport, the car is your only option.
You make a good point but only if your country actually has roads.
If you live somewhere with no paved roads and only railroads, then that and walking are your only options.
(Sarcasm but I’m curious if you see the point)
You’re trying to be sarcastic but you just described rural Canada
Well yes, except all the railroads where removed. Just lifted trucks and gravel roads as far as the eye can see.
You make a good point but only if your country has people.
If you live somewhere with no people and only animals, then you can’t get anywhere and must traverse the jungle with a machete and a canteen full of either rainwater or your own piss.
😊
That’s why the post advocates for public transport. So that we can have better options.
If you live somewhere, you’re a part of the body that decides things like that. If you want public transit in your community, and you certainly should, take the steps to get the action started.
Nobody is going to change the world on our behalf; it all falls on us.
Whats one of the concrete steps? I don’t know where you lives but here it seems impossible to push for that.
Starts by being an active member of the community. Attend counsel meetings, town hearings, etc. Bring up the topic at these, gauge the response. Talk to the people who seem enthusiastic in response. Work together and build a petition, then seek signatures first amongst the people who attend, then talk to your neighbors.
I never said it was going to be easy, I only said nobody else is going to do it on your behalf.
The correct answer actually should -and could- be 0 gallons if they simply cycle to work. Granted, that requires them to have the right infrastructure available, but if (once) that existed, the vast majority of the work force could cycle to work happily. Most people don’t live 20 miles or more from where they work
It could also be 0 gallons if the busses are electrified, or if the rail system is expanded, or if we stop pushing office workers to commute every day.
There are many routes to 0 emissions.
Oh sure.
I’m just sayjt that we need to change the way we live. Like you said, people should not be required to work in offices anymore. If they physically need to be at locations, let them walk for short distances, cycle for medium distances and use public transportation for large distances.
Most cities in the world have been redesigned over the past 80 years for cars. It’s insane and it left most cities awful places to live in. Almost all Dutch cities have been redesigned for people. So people walk and cycle because they can, and the cities look and feel amazing and beautiful.
How many gallons does the ambulance take to get the cyclist to the hospital after the hit and run?
(Seriously tho bicycles ftw except in winter)
Less, probably, because cycling in on itself is safer than driving a car. Lower speeds, less mass, less injuries.
Also, winter cycling.is awesome
I was being facetious; ambulance fuel use is a silly comparison :)
Listening to all y’all winter cyclists I lament that I live in a city where the bike lanes are where the city piles up the snow it plows off the car lanes on the streets. RIP me. It gives me hope and happiness to know that there are cities that don’t do this!
Yeah those would be cities that see bikes as children’s toys instead of what they are: a better form of medium range transit
Sure, I’d love to cycle 56km to and from work each day. Especially right after a night shift.
We should just invent portals already.
If we invented portals I feel like they would use more fossil fuels than just driving.
I think the bones are fully consumed by the teleportation ritual.
bones will be the fuel
Green and renewable fossil fuel (don’t ask where we get the bones)
56 kms is far, indeed. Thsts what you make public transportation for. Trains, busses.
Well done, the would be more comfortable and faster than a car.
However, I did 25 kms to and from every day. Took me 45 minutes and it was super healthy
I commute with a car to a bus. I lived closer but this only takes 15min more.
45 minutes is a long time near nightfall, though… Honestly I’d rather take a bus at 5PM, even at 12km, since there are other people and it feels much safer.
Maybe… Move closer to where you work?
I never thought of that. Thanks! Now I just need a shit ton of money to do so!
We need to get one more man to work
