No, there are plenty of genuine Greens and Socialists, no question about it. Quite a few post content on Lemmy without anyone bothering them.
You very specifically get a lot of heat though. This is due to how you interact in comment sections with people, and why you draw so much more heat than our entire instances of actual Marxist-Leninists.
The poster you’re replying to is very much designed to drive engagement, and any attention, good or bad, serves its purposes. I’d rather not feed this particular type of poster, but if we don’t point out the flaws in its reasoning, we might lose a few of those genuine Greens and Socialists.
I don’t disagree that voting in America is a pick between a steaming mug of donkey pee, and an elephant dung sandwich, and has been this way for decades. I’m even with you in that we should have a choice that doesn’t include donkey pee and elephant dung. But the reality is you can’t have 150 million different people in the world’s largest picnic each get different food, so there HAS to be a limited menu to vote from, lest nobody can agree on what we’re gonna eat and we all go hungry. And whatever has the most votes at the end of the day will be what we all eat, and unfortunately, that looks like it’ll be between not just donkey pee and elephant dung, but that the elephant has a bad case of gastroenteritis and the bread on the sandwich is EXTREMELY mouldy, AND there are a crazy number of rabid fans of elephant dung sandwiches for some fucked up reason. There are also a lot of crazies who have a taste for donkey pee, but at least you can wash that down with a stiff alcoholic drink. The elephant diarrhoea with two mouldy pieces of bread, on the other hand, can’t be gotten rid of except with a high-pressure wash. Since I don’t want the elephant excrement consumers to dictate what I am doing, and there’s not enough sane people in the world to offset the donkey pee or elephant dung choosers, I’ll pick the lesser of two evils.
And I say this as someone who is already a lockin for Proposition 131 (Colorado’s RCV) and who has voted third party in the past.
Yeah, I’m aware. I don’t think additional engagement in here actually benefits his goals in the long run, though, so I’m more than happy to take advantage of the situation to discuss the finer points of internet trolling for the benefit of the broader community.
edit: I also actually enjoy this process somewhat, it reminds me of simpler times I suppose. lol
True. Playing Whack-A-Troll is always fun…but we do have to be careful because the Mods have taken HUGE exceptions to calling a spade a spade here, while allowing this poster we’re talking about and a whole metric fuckton of other posters with … similar MOs to post their unmitigated BS unchallenged. Something about wanting to remain civil or something, despite this poster and others like it directly and overtly saying that they’ll keep posting their nonsense just to get a rise out of us. You know, the actual definition of trolling?
Fortunately I am also a fairly skilled line toe-er. I can take full advantage of the exact same loopholes as he does.
If this community is going to go down the 4chan troll-hole, which seems steadily more likely as time goes on, I’m not letting it go without a rhetorical fight. Especially when it comes with a pleasant dose of nostalgia.
Heh, I’ll leave it to you then. I’ll point out the flaws in this poster’s logic as I can, but really…with how prolific it is (can’t say it’s a bot, can’t say it’s a bot…), that’d be a fucking full-time job.
I honestly don’t think it is a bot. I think its a young guy, teens or early 20s, very strong Trump supporter willing to do whatever might help his boy without having to do anything that’s not fun.
Could be, though I’d question the prolificness. I guess that’s why the mods come down on us so hard. You can’t be certain of anything because…well, there ARE Russian bot-farms, Trumpers (even teams of them operating in tandem), and of course True Believers ™, and short of catching the guy in the act and examining his rig, you can’t be sure what you’re dealing with. That said, IMO, there’s not really a huge difference between them when it comes to debunking them. A vote for a third party is a vote for the major party most opposed to your third party in the USA. At least until we get RCV in more places!
What makes trolls so difficult to stamp out is they enjoy the process. You used to be able to starve them by depriving them of interaction, but after qanon demonstrated that internet trolling can have real-world effects, that method stopped working. Now it’s a combination of fun and political activism. Where fun leaves off as a motivation, the activism takes over and vice-versa. The combo can reasonably make one extremely prolific, just like how somebody can spend a whole day playing a video game they really like.
The only way to truly combat them at the community level nowadays is to embrace your inner teenager and approach them with the exact same duo of motivations. Since I’m also engaging in an entertaining process, while hopefully providing some education on trolling techniques and critical thinking, I can match his enthusiasm to the extent that real life allows me.
The rest is just checking your phone for notifications regularly, which I do anyway. lol
And this poster’s response to this was as predictable as the sun rising in the east, setting in the west, water rolling downhill, and Russell Wilson sitting on the bench for a different team while we pay for him. 🤣
You called this poster out properly, and the mods refusal to let us call a spade a spade here. Readers, I invite you to read the definition of a troll from Merriam-Webster: to antagonize (others) online by deliberately posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments or other disruptive content. The poster that constantly changes its name over and over again repeats it’ll keep posting its content despite being soundly rejected over and over again, just so it can piss us off. I’m not asking for it to be removed, though I sure won’t turn down such an outcome. But can we at least call a spade a spade where this poster is concerned?
The reason the mods refuse “to acknowledge it” is because I’m not a troll. Just because you don’t agree with and you don’t like what I’m saying, doesn’t make me a troll.
This community is about diverse political thought. It wasn’t created to be an echo chamber in favor of one party.
Yeah? Because I refuse to change my mind? Beause I still haven’t. Downvotes or not. I’ll post what I want, where I want, when I want and I’ll vote for who I want to. As I respect others rights to do the same. Thank you! :)
No, not because you won’t change your mind, none of the Marxist-Leninists change their minds on a lot of stuff and still don’t draw much heat. Something else.
Why would I care what you or anyone else thinks about other socialists? I have the freedom to believe what I want, vote for who I want, and think for myself.
I’m sure some socialists agree with me, and some don’t.
That’s fine—everyone’s entitled to their own view. You have yours too, and I respect your right to that, but I’m not going to change what I believe just because you don’t like it. Thank you, friend! :)
Just correcting your thought. You like to frequently talk about how persecuted you are for your beliefs, but this is a red herring you lay down, since other people that post pro-socialist content do not get the same reaction as you. If this deflection is intentional, then you’re just lying.
Since other people get different reactions for posting the same sort of content you post, it must not be about the content. Some other aspect of your behavior, perhaps, that has nothing to do with being pro-socialist or critical of democrats. Personally I think it’s your incessant engagement in trolling behavior, but that’s just my own view that I am fully entitled to, of course. :)
See, I didn’t ask you to change, I’m just making sure the record is correct. The only one talking about you changing … is you.
Why would I let your opinions—or anyone else’s on Lemmy—dictate what I believe? Everyone’s free to think what they want, just as I’m free to do the same.
Personally I think it’s your incessant engagement in trolling behavior,
And personally I don’t think I’m engaging in trolling behavior. That’s my view that I am fully entitled to, of course. :)
Feel free to block me if you are tired of reading my posts or responding.
I don’t care if you think I’m a troll. I’m gonna post what I want, where I want, when I want. As is my right. I don’t have to explain anything to you if I don’t want to.
See, there’s your subtle lie again. I’m not trying to dictate your beliefs, I’m just pointing out patterns. You can believe them or not as you wish. I’m not trying to control you, I’m making sure information is provided to the community. I’m not trying to force you to explain anything, or abuse you, I’m not persecuting you. I’m just disagreeing with you, that’s it. All the persecution is in that cute little head of yours.
Oh, I have no interest in blocking you. I’d much rather watch you and use you as an educational example. A lot of people on here are ignorant of more advanced trolling techniques, which makes them vulnerable. A small silver lining of your existence is that you help remedy this.
Why would I let your opinions—or anyone else’s on Lemmy—dictate what I believe?
To which I responded that I am simply disagreeing with you, not trying to “dictate your beliefs”. That’s your persecution lie, a bit of a cornerstone of your persona on here.
I still haven’t fully settled on if you’re doing it intentionally or you’re just really, really Christian. The persecution complex is extremely common in the devout, stemming from their stories about the early days of the church. But yes, I suspect you probably are a troll.
No, there are plenty of genuine Greens and Socialists, no question about it. Quite a few post content on Lemmy without anyone bothering them.
You very specifically get a lot of heat though. This is due to how you interact in comment sections with people, and why you draw so much more heat than our entire instances of actual Marxist-Leninists.
The poster you’re replying to is very much designed to drive engagement, and any attention, good or bad, serves its purposes. I’d rather not feed this particular type of poster, but if we don’t point out the flaws in its reasoning, we might lose a few of those genuine Greens and Socialists.
I don’t disagree that voting in America is a pick between a steaming mug of donkey pee, and an elephant dung sandwich, and has been this way for decades. I’m even with you in that we should have a choice that doesn’t include donkey pee and elephant dung. But the reality is you can’t have 150 million different people in the world’s largest picnic each get different food, so there HAS to be a limited menu to vote from, lest nobody can agree on what we’re gonna eat and we all go hungry. And whatever has the most votes at the end of the day will be what we all eat, and unfortunately, that looks like it’ll be between not just donkey pee and elephant dung, but that the elephant has a bad case of gastroenteritis and the bread on the sandwich is EXTREMELY mouldy, AND there are a crazy number of rabid fans of elephant dung sandwiches for some fucked up reason. There are also a lot of crazies who have a taste for donkey pee, but at least you can wash that down with a stiff alcoholic drink. The elephant diarrhoea with two mouldy pieces of bread, on the other hand, can’t be gotten rid of except with a high-pressure wash. Since I don’t want the elephant excrement consumers to dictate what I am doing, and there’s not enough sane people in the world to offset the donkey pee or elephant dung choosers, I’ll pick the lesser of two evils.
And I say this as someone who is already a lockin for Proposition 131 (Colorado’s RCV) and who has voted third party in the past.
Yeah, I’m aware. I don’t think additional engagement in here actually benefits his goals in the long run, though, so I’m more than happy to take advantage of the situation to discuss the finer points of internet trolling for the benefit of the broader community.
edit: I also actually enjoy this process somewhat, it reminds me of simpler times I suppose. lol
True. Playing Whack-A-Troll is always fun…but we do have to be careful because the Mods have taken HUGE exceptions to calling a spade a spade here, while allowing this poster we’re talking about and a whole metric fuckton of other posters with … similar MOs to post their unmitigated BS unchallenged. Something about wanting to remain civil or something, despite this poster and others like it directly and overtly saying that they’ll keep posting their nonsense just to get a rise out of us. You know, the actual definition of trolling?
Fortunately I am also a fairly skilled line toe-er. I can take full advantage of the exact same loopholes as he does.
If this community is going to go down the 4chan troll-hole, which seems steadily more likely as time goes on, I’m not letting it go without a rhetorical fight. Especially when it comes with a pleasant dose of nostalgia.
Heh, I’ll leave it to you then. I’ll point out the flaws in this poster’s logic as I can, but really…with how prolific it is (can’t say it’s a bot, can’t say it’s a bot…), that’d be a fucking full-time job.
I honestly don’t think it is a bot. I think its a young guy, teens or early 20s, very strong Trump supporter willing to do whatever might help his boy without having to do anything that’s not fun.
Which amounts to trolling on Lemmy apparently.
Could be, though I’d question the prolificness. I guess that’s why the mods come down on us so hard. You can’t be certain of anything because…well, there ARE Russian bot-farms, Trumpers (even teams of them operating in tandem), and of course True Believers ™, and short of catching the guy in the act and examining his rig, you can’t be sure what you’re dealing with. That said, IMO, there’s not really a huge difference between them when it comes to debunking them. A vote for a third party is a vote for the major party most opposed to your third party in the USA. At least until we get RCV in more places!
What makes trolls so difficult to stamp out is they enjoy the process. You used to be able to starve them by depriving them of interaction, but after qanon demonstrated that internet trolling can have real-world effects, that method stopped working. Now it’s a combination of fun and political activism. Where fun leaves off as a motivation, the activism takes over and vice-versa. The combo can reasonably make one extremely prolific, just like how somebody can spend a whole day playing a video game they really like.
The only way to truly combat them at the community level nowadays is to embrace your inner teenager and approach them with the exact same duo of motivations. Since I’m also engaging in an entertaining process, while hopefully providing some education on trolling techniques and critical thinking, I can match his enthusiasm to the extent that real life allows me.
The rest is just checking your phone for notifications regularly, which I do anyway. lol
So much this. And it’s precisely how you can tell he’s a troll despite the /c/politics mod’s refusal to acknowledge it.
And this poster’s response to this was as predictable as the sun rising in the east, setting in the west, water rolling downhill, and Russell Wilson sitting on the bench for a different team while we pay for him. 🤣
You called this poster out properly, and the mods refusal to let us call a spade a spade here. Readers, I invite you to read the definition of a troll from Merriam-Webster: to antagonize (others) online by deliberately posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments or other disruptive content. The poster that constantly changes its name over and over again repeats it’ll keep posting its content despite being soundly rejected over and over again, just so it can piss us off. I’m not asking for it to be removed, though I sure won’t turn down such an outcome. But can we at least call a spade a spade where this poster is concerned?
The reason the mods refuse “to acknowledge it” is because I’m not a troll. Just because you don’t agree with and you don’t like what I’m saying, doesn’t make me a troll.
This community is about diverse political thought. It wasn’t created to be an echo chamber in favor of one party.
Thank you!
Once again you intentionally miss the point. It’s your core competency.
I quoted your words, friend.
And?
And I didn’t miss the point at all. I told you that the mods don’t think I’m a troll, regardless of how much you disagree with my political opinions.
They have removed plenty of my comments when they think I have gone too far. There is no favoritism shown towards me, nor would I ask for any.
Ok? That’s what I said before you even joined the conversation. So did you think you were adding anything of value here?
So then you don’t think I’m a troll?
Public forum. I am allowed to give my input. And I did, friend. Thanks!
Yeah? Because I refuse to change my mind? Beause I still haven’t. Downvotes or not. I’ll post what I want, where I want, when I want and I’ll vote for who I want to. As I respect others rights to do the same. Thank you! :)
No, not because you won’t change your mind, none of the Marxist-Leninists change their minds on a lot of stuff and still don’t draw much heat. Something else.
Why would I care what you or anyone else thinks about other socialists? I have the freedom to believe what I want, vote for who I want, and think for myself.
I’m sure some socialists agree with me, and some don’t.
That’s fine—everyone’s entitled to their own view. You have yours too, and I respect your right to that, but I’m not going to change what I believe just because you don’t like it. Thank you, friend! :)
Just correcting your thought. You like to frequently talk about how persecuted you are for your beliefs, but this is a red herring you lay down, since other people that post pro-socialist content do not get the same reaction as you. If this deflection is intentional, then you’re just lying.
Since other people get different reactions for posting the same sort of content you post, it must not be about the content. Some other aspect of your behavior, perhaps, that has nothing to do with being pro-socialist or critical of democrats. Personally I think it’s your incessant engagement in trolling behavior, but that’s just my own view that I am fully entitled to, of course. :)
See, I didn’t ask you to change, I’m just making sure the record is correct. The only one talking about you changing … is you.
Why would I let your opinions—or anyone else’s on Lemmy—dictate what I believe? Everyone’s free to think what they want, just as I’m free to do the same.
And personally I don’t think I’m engaging in trolling behavior. That’s my view that I am fully entitled to, of course. :)
Feel free to block me if you are tired of reading my posts or responding.
I don’t care if you think I’m a troll. I’m gonna post what I want, where I want, when I want. As is my right. I don’t have to explain anything to you if I don’t want to.
I’m not going anywhere. Thanks, friend! :)
See, there’s your subtle lie again. I’m not trying to dictate your beliefs, I’m just pointing out patterns. You can believe them or not as you wish. I’m not trying to control you, I’m making sure information is provided to the community. I’m not trying to force you to explain anything, or abuse you, I’m not persecuting you. I’m just disagreeing with you, that’s it. All the persecution is in that cute little head of yours.
Oh, I have no interest in blocking you. I’d much rather watch you and use you as an educational example. A lot of people on here are ignorant of more advanced trolling techniques, which makes them vulnerable. A small silver lining of your existence is that you help remedy this.
I didn’t say you were. Do you think that everytime I point out something or say something, it’s some little lie or deceit to trick you! lmao
Because you can’t. :)
Cool! I’m disagreeing with you too. So are we friends now?!
I love that you think of me so much and are so interested in me! Thank you!!
I’m not sure what you mean. Who is trolling here? Why are you being so vague?
Sure you did. Right here:
To which I responded that I am simply disagreeing with you, not trying to “dictate your beliefs”. That’s your persecution lie, a bit of a cornerstone of your persona on here.
I still haven’t fully settled on if you’re doing it intentionally or you’re just really, really Christian. The persecution complex is extremely common in the devout, stemming from their stories about the early days of the church. But yes, I suspect you probably are a troll.