The main thing about Fairphone is not the phone but the supply chain.
https://www.fairphone.com/en/impact/
Nothing is perfect and a phone cannot make happy every one (is there a jack or not …). But I’m happy that they try to make a good phone with all the hidden things in mind (from where come from the rough material, who is making the pieces and in which conditions …). That’s more important for me then the final product.
Yeah when I need to get a new phone I’m 100% getting a FairPhone. My last phone lived for multiple years past the security updates. All my phones over the years have died to some trivial problem that wasn’t worth fixing (e.g. bad charging port). But a fixable phone with eight years of security updates? Sign me the fuck up. The only reason my current phone isn’t a FairPhone is because they didn’t sell in the US when I needed a new one.
I might get flack for this but I despise them for their greenwashing. removing the headphone jack to sell their own Bluetooth headphones was mmmmmmh move at best.
I despise people repeating comments. How is making the device cheaper, more sustainable, and more reliable greenwashing? I would love anybody who just loves complaining about the headphones jack to explain that. No one else has. I doubt anybody complaining really cares about the environment either. What phone do you currently have?
How is removing the jack making the device more sustainable or reliable?
It allowed them to increase the IP rating, allows for simplified manufacturing, and easier maintainability and repairability.
How is not including it considered greenwashing (I notice you didn’t ask about that, so I assume you know the answer)?
Plenty of electronics have been able to get IP ratings while still having headphone jacks. It’s a trivial part to include as it is practically an ancient bit of tech and doesn’t introduce some kind of massive complexity to the device. Repair is a simple swap of the module. Nothing you’re saying has anything to do with supporting your claim of its removal leading to greater sustainability or reliability. Its materials are no different from the rest of the phone, meaning it’s just as sustainable as the rest of the parts, and it’s not a part that’s prone to failure, meaning it’s just as reliable as the rest.
For more cost. And again, their question was how does it affect reliability. I provided other reasons. This is like fucking whackamole. Folks just responding to the random comment that was responding to one specific thing and then pretending like it’s the entire fucking argument. This whole thread is filled with idiots. Jacks have been left out of most flagship phones for a couple years now. This honestly smells like a fake grassroots attack on the Fairphone because they pay people fucking living wages instead of goddamn slave wages. The headphone jack was never a selling point of the phone. And it’s not like you need to buy their headphones.
And headphone jacks are absolutely prone to failure. That’s just objectively fucking false ignorant of electronics. It’s an additional component. Maintainability and reliability inherently goes down if you add components. It’s not magically a part of the fucking PCB. It’s soldered on and then anytime a headphone plug is put in, it will put stress on the solder joints anytime it moves. Did you just fucking guess and hope you’re right about “it’s just as reliable”?
This thread is shit. I’m done here. Can I just block an entire post to stop seeing asinine replies from jackasses who probably don’t even have a headphone jack on their current phone?
Lol, what a tantrum. I responded directly to the points you raised and this epic rant is your reply.
For more cost? Headphone jacks are not even remotely expensive. Yes, they’ve been left out of a number of other phones for several years now. I and many others complained about it then and we’re still complaining about it now. This isn’t a Fairphone specific complaint, but it does suck to see yet another company go this route. And I promise you, headphone jacks have no bearing on the shit pay practices of the entire smartphone industry.
I didn’t say headphone jacks don’t ever fail. Maybe reread what I wrote before you go on a rant. Look up failure rates of headphone jacks vs other components and you’ll see that they’re not more prone to failure than other components. And why would the headphone jack in a Fairphone be soldered on? To make it repairable, shouldn’t it be a separate module you can swap out if it does fail? By your own logic, they should take USB ports out of phones for the very same reasons they removed headphone jacks. And who knows, maybe that’s where the market will go. As for me, my next phone will be a Sony Xperia, since they still make high end phones with SD card slots, headphone jacks, and have bezels for the front facing camera so you don’t interrupt the screen. These are all features important to me, so that’s where my money will go when it comes time to replace my 4 year old phone.
Also, great use of ad hominems and “you’re all shills!” when you’re confronted with things you can’t refute. This thread isn’t shit, but your poor grasp of logic, name calling, and goalpost shifting sure is. And yes, you can mute an entire post. The exact process will depend on if you’re using the website or the specific app, but I’m sure if you go to the support community of whatever you’re using and ask them in the same charming way you’re speaking here, you’ll get the help you need to mute this whole post.
It’s honestly kinda hilarious that the person defending the anti-consumer choice to remove features is accusing those upset about their removal of shilling.
The way i understand it, they ditch the jack so they can sell ppl their earbuds while claiming it’s about the environment. No idea if that’s true, but i don’t really care about this angle. Also, regarding the IP rating, you could add a rubber flap over it, pretty sure some CAT phones had that. Still, my biggest gripe is the jack situation, though a secondary sim slot and a smaller screen would be nice.
Personally, the best phone for me, that i know of, would be a Galaxy XCover 5 - small, durable, removable battery, jack, dedicated microsd slot and dualsim. Shame it doesn’t support any variant of degoogled android.
I don’t agree with the OP that removing the jack is a mortal sin. However having worked in related induatries, I don’t think removing it really saves much if any money and it is entirely possible to make a phone or any other electronic device water resistant even with a headphone jack. Hell you can get wired ear buds that can be submerged in water.
I know it wasn’t mentioned specifically, but even fairly cheap watches will be water proof to like 30 meters and still have a user replacable battery.
I just wish companies would be honest about it.
The usual argument is “FP5 bad because no headphone jack, I choose Nokia or Samsung”… I guess if you’re not even trying to have a fair and sustainable supply chain, that’s totally fine.
Don’t have many options if i need the headphone jack
You have $5 options.
can’t get a phone for 5$
You can get a phone jack adapter for $5 moron.
shit solution, spend more money to fix a design fuckup
Fair and sustainable supply chains shouldn’t mean I have to throw out perfectly good electronics at home, such as wired headphones, because this company wants to save a trivial amount of money. Keeping the headphone jack means a greater level of sustainability because I don’t have to replace other fully functional electronics to use with this phone.
Here we go again… Adapters exist, nobody is forcing you to literally throw away your headphones. If the small inconvenience of using an adapter is so overwhelming for you that you’ll throw the whole sustainability argument right out the window and go for a company that doesn’t give two shits about it, then go for it. But don’t claim that sustainability matters to you, because it obviously doesn’t.
Here we go again… I know adapters exist. I have one. If I didn’t, my wired headphones and my wired aux port in my car would be unusable. If the large ecological footprint of an entire new product line that’s completely unnecessary being spun up to use a whole bunch of excess materials that didn’t need to be used to just keep the existing headphone jacks doesn’t bother you, maybe you’re the one throwing the whole sustainability argument out the window because you clearly don’t give two shits about it.
So you have an adapter and are fine using it - where’s the problem? In your last comment you said you’d have to throw away your headphones, which seems really disingenuous now.
You now have the choice of a) buying a sustainably sourced and fairly produced phone without a headphone jack or b) buying a phone of questionable sustainability and fairness with a headphone jack. The choice is really obvious if you ask me, considering the adapter is a sunk cost to the environment and you.
Do the adapters grow on trees? How does creating an entirely new and wholly unnecessary product line match up with any sort of sustainability standards? Seems pretty disingenuous to me. Try looking at the big picture and not just the actions of a single company in isolation.
Yeah I bought a phone without a headphone jack. So I bought a little adapter and keep it in my case. Then my headphones started to fail and I got a pair that could do both Bluetooth and aux. Now I have headphones that can be used with a dead battery or can be used without a wire. Win-win.
Would I prefer a headphone jack? Yes. But the adapter lives on the end of the removable aux cable, so the functional difference is minimal. Especially since I also have wireless charging, so I can avoid the very minor “can’t charge and use AUX at the same time” problem.
I’m afraid your experience and opinion is just too nuanced for some people here. It really seems like you’re doubting our lord and saviour the headphone jack, so let the downvotes commence!
If I’m gonna focus on the headphone jack then I could simply say that it’s already a cheap and reliable part that provides better quality sound that Bluetooth most of the time. Wired headphones are also way cheaper to buy and in my experience easier to fix. the Bluetooth earphones when their battery starts dying down or gets damaged will be thrown away and create more waste.
Wether this company IMHO is greenwashing OR the competition on the mobile segment is just too great and I want to believe the latter.
I think that the phone is also way too expensive, yes the phone is repairable but the components are still quite expensive to replace (although very easy to do so).
Fairphone has made too many faux pas with this one.
As for my phone, I am not a reference in that matter I upgraded to a zenfone 10 that I intend to keep for 4 years (until no more security updates). the phone cannot get it’s bootloader unlocked but I’m not going to dive into that at this point. A small phone with a decent headphone jack with latest specs and big amount of storage.
I am in Asia and I had a degoogled phone but it’s extremely hard and inconvenient most of the time (even with microg). so anyway just to say I won’t be tinkering with the phone just using open source apps as much as possible.
Did they mention warranty for the headphones?
I agree removing the headphone jack is annoying, but I’m sure the Bluetooth works with any device that supports the format, not just theirs. Apple tries to push Apple stuff and they know their stupid user base will buy the Apple version if they have it, but I doubt the same is true here. If they had a wired and wireless headphone, would you suspect them to be trying to force you to buy their headphones still with the 5mm jack?
I’m contemplating getting the fairphone 5. The usb c port on my last few phones were getting very loose at the end of the use. Making it a hassle using it in my car. One steep curve, and the phone slides making the connection get loose.
If I get the fairphone 5 I will immediately get a USB c replacement for future proofing.
It’s annoying charging my phone at night and waking up to an almost empty phone because the cable got loose when I set it on my bedside table.
I had to replace the USB C port on my Fairphone 3, took about €30 and 10 minutes.
In any other phone it would’ve meant getting a complete new device
It’s actually surprisingly easy to do on a OnePlus 5T. I did it after cleaning out the port wasn’t good enough anymore (my phone was bought secondhand/refurb, and I also recently replaced the battery too . - overall the cost of both endeavours including the cheapo kit to get the thing open in the first place was on the order of £25, though I did lose the two screws for the USB port that connext it to the bottom, still works fine with the other two internal screws though 🤣).
Eventually secondhand parts will stop being available on ebay, but for now its all good ;p. Though if your screen breaks it’s probably not worth it to replace, that part alone seems to be half the secondhand-price of a lot of phones all on it’s own >.<
I have replaced a micro usb port on an old phone before. But because it’s hard soldered it takes a lot of effort and time. I wouldn’t want to try that with usb c because it has way more leads.
Meh, I could replace entire bottom board on my Xiaomi Mi4 in about 10 minutes. Way back in 2014, best phone I’ve ever owned.
Some devices have the port on the mobo. I canonly think ione I’ve owned like this.
All my other phones it’s been replaceable.
Probably not your problem, but my completely different phone (oneplus 7 pro)has been pretty solid. But, lint and dust gathered into the port, making some of the plugs extremely loose to the point it would fall out from the weight of the cable… I took a needle and scraped out the compacted lint at the bottom. (avoiding touching the middle thing in the port. Good as new afterwards, even the one cable I’ve been using with the phone since 2019 which is pretty loose after use now, still sits without problems when moving the phone around.
But I’d definitely suggest cleaning it out if you haven’t. Even the small specs you get out makes a big difference. My powerbank came wouldn’t stay in, after cleaning it’s more well behaved. But there’s a clear difference in USB-c plugs and how they fit phones.
use a toothpick so you can’t short anything
Thanks, I have a oneplus 7T and I have been cleaning it. It’s just very loose now. Been scraping the harder to clean parts with a toothpick, and the rest with a toothbrush. It just isn’t working for me. Might have to try a needle now.
If the 7T is constructed anything like the 5T then replacing the USB port is an inexpensive and relatively easy weekend project. You just undo a couple of T5 screws, pop off the back, undo a couple more screws and replace the assembly. The hard part is not losing the screws.
Considering software support period is over I don’t think it’s worth the hassle of getting the back off. The oneplus security update period is also abysmal.
I looked up how to get the back off.
Also a reason I’m contemplating the fairphone 5. Just pull off the back and a few screws later it’s pretty much done. I don’t want to mess with a heat gun to open up my phone.
Had that issue before, annoying as fuck. My latest one has a case with a small cap for the USBC port. Eliminated the problem. Love it.
These comments remind me about how when you try to do something great, the vast majority of the feedback will be from people who were never going to buy into your idea in the first place. The fact that they’re on version 5 tells me there’s demand for an ethically sourced, user-repairable phone with a long support life. Go start your own phone company if you don’t like it.
Where’s the headphone jack?
I really wanted to get this phone, but at 850Eur that’s a hard pass from me. I could let the lack of jack and FM radio slide, as well as some design choices that they made, as sacrifices need to be made to make it modular. But I can find that hardware in phones that cost a quarter of a Fairphone. And then there is the repair cost, where the parts cost almost twice as much as getting a non-fair phone repaired at a shop (even moreso if I were to use aliexpress parts and home repair). Again, I fully expect a repairable and fair-source phone to perform worse than a regular one, but this is like paying iPhone money for a Xiaomi midranger.
Also, the 8 year warrranty feels like a scam because the chip they use will be out of production in 4-5 years.Of course it’s more expensive than other phones with similar specifications.
The main point here isn’t to be fair to consumers by allowing them to repair their phones and giving them upgrades. The main point is to create a phone that is paying living wages to those producing it, and uses as many recycled minerals as possible and seeks to not be an absolute disaster for the planet.
If people stopped a while to wonder why their smaprtphoens are so goddamn cheap, I think people would be lining up to pay more for them. It’s not even remotely sustainable.
I’ve been corrected on the price - looks like I was using an older quote.
I do realize that their point is to make the phone’s manufacturing process fairer, but their older models were more decently priced, so I wonder how much of that tag is actually due the higher cost of manufacturing.
Still, since people switch phones a lot earlier than EoL, it would be nice if there was a way to discourage the frequent switching ( for marginal performance gains ) and instead encourage keeping smartphones until EoL ( which, granted, for some manufacturers is less than 2 years )
Fairphone is a social enterprise, and most Dutch companies presenting themselves as such are actually held to certain standards.
I haven’t confirmed this myself, but I wouldn’t be surprised if they actually publish all of their expenses so you can do the math yourself.
They have published a full breakdown for an earlier model: Over here
Oh wow I didn’t know they published the cost breakdowns for some of their models thats really cool! Thank you for posting that
Regular companies have an obligation to deposit their annual accounts with the chamber of commerce, but social enterprises tend to go above and beyond because their focus is not on economic gain, but on socio-economic gain.
There is no legal obligation to do anything special when you call yourself a social enterprise, that I know of. But using the description for bragging rights does put your company under increased scrutiny from the community and from researchers.
All kinds of modeling methods have been invented to make social-economic impact part of the businessmodel. Some of those methods are even similar to Alex Osterwalder’s widely used Business Model Canvas.
Some social enterpreneurs also make use of specific constructions using certain legal forms to prevent shareholders from steering the company away from its original goal. For example: some will opt to make a “stichting” (foundation) the majority shareholder of the main company. The stichting having auditing and course correction as their main purpose.
If you would like to know more about social enterprises, the dutch chamber of commerce has published a great article (in english) on the subject.
Are we using different websites? It’s 700 euro for me, not 850. Also it’s 5 year warranty and 8 years of updates.
Yeah, just noticed the new price. It’s not available in my country yet so I was quoting the one listed on gsmarena. At 700Eur it does make more sense, as it’s a similar price to the old Fairphone in 8gb guise.
This post has devolved into shit and filled with a bunch of whiners complaining about the same dumb shit that isn’t a goal of this phone. Might as well whine the new iPhone doesn’t cost under $400 for as reasonable of a complaint anything on this post is.
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The Fairphone 4 did eventually make it to the US, so I’m hopeful that we’ll eventually get the 5 too. According to GSMArena it already supports the necessary LTE/5G bands for my US network.
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Bummer.
Looks like it has all the necessary bands for Australian networks, too, so this seems like a licensing/distribution issue more than a technical issue. I really hope they release globally at some point. I will consider importing one if I can find it at a good price.
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Can’t get one off eBay or something?
An article I came across said there are no plans for the 5 in the US, so not at the moment at least.
Occasionally sluggish performance
Wonder how it will be in 5 years. Personally think you’d be better of buying high end now and keeping it longer. Also I never had any component fail on my Samsung devices (except screen but that was self inflicted and the repair prices of samsung are more than fair). Same with iPhones, they are way more durable than fairphones.
I don’t know of any high end Android phone manufacturer that promises security updates for >5 years. If you want to keep your phone that long or even longer, there are few choices unless you want to be vulnerable.
Also, I have no idea what exactly “more durable” is supposed to mean, but I’m very much certain that Apple’s and Samsung’s batteries degrade the same and their screens also crack when dropped. A replacement part and the repair will be significantly cheaper with FairPhone, especially for people who don’t want or dare to do it themselves because of anti-repair measures by the manufacturers.
For reference, a replacement screen for FP5 costs 100€ and comes with straightforward instructions from the manufacturer. An Apple screen replacement will cost you 340€ and there are no official ways to get replacement parts or do the repair yourself. You have to pay half a FP5’s worth just for an iPhone screen repair.
Edit: Spelling correction
Samsung and Google promise 5 years of updates. Google is said to provide more with the pixel 8.
Samsung charges 140 to 175 € for a repair on the s23. While almost twice as much as the fairphone, I still think its fair. I have to agree that what apple charges is way to much but that’s how it is.
As for durable I meant no random hardware fails. They are incredibly long lasting. My galaxy s4 and s6 still work to this day.
I’ve used pixel phones for a long time, but I’ll eat my hat if Google actually honors more than 5 years of updates for the pixel 8.
Sceurity updates shmecurity updates. How many stories of someone bank account being robbed through old android vunerbality have you heard about. Im not saying they are worthelss beacuse Obviusly its better to be secured than not but they really shouldnt be a factor when choosing whetewer to buy a new phone or keep using old one. Especialy if you are like a year behind or something similar.
Yep, still use my S10e which is almost 5 years old. Still as perfect as day 1. Not sure what to buy next, as small and as durable as this one…
I still use my Note 9 from time to time and it’s extremely responsive. The only thing I notice is the low refresh rate of the screen.
@redditReallySucks imo, as long as Google Play Services gets updated on your device, you shouldn’t have many issues. E.g. check how backwards compatible are apps on Android
Wish it had a jack
I don’t see the big deal about headphone jacks. If you really want wired headphones, stick a dongle on the end of the cable and leave it there. It’s almost exactly the same, except you can’t charge and listen at the same time - not really something I would worry about.
All this accomplishes is an unnecessary inconvenience. I shouldn’t have to lug additional cables, and far more importantly the choice between Wired/Wireless should be up to me, not the manufacturer
That USBC dongle will sound much much better than the weak DAC they’d pair with the headphone jack anyway.
I have a headphone jack on my 4a but I still use the dongle because the dongle can actually drive speakers.
It’s like complaining a new PC doesn’t come with USB-A and only USB-C.
Design decisions shouldn’t always be up to the end user. Every single option can’t always be included forever and ever.
If you want wired for quality, you need a DAC anyway. If you want wired otherwise, leave the adapter on your headphones.
Don’t let your inability to adapt stifle actual developmental progress.
Removing things that loads of customers want because you want to sell them Bluetooth headphones is not progress lol
The only reason i don’t buy it is because it’s too big. Particularly for a phone i would commit to for a longer lifespan, the physical design needs to be without compromise, and i know that the moment someone releases a half-way decent mini Android phone, i will drop whatever phone i have and buy that instead.
I fear you’ll be waiting a long time.
I fear that too. But so long as my current phone holds out, there’s no point buying into another compromise upfront.
So… The Asus Zenfone 10?
That’s the same size as an iPhone 15 or Galaxy S23, not “mini”.
We ever figure out if this can be unlocked? I know it was then it wasn’t, etc.
As far as I know it can.
I think Sony still releases decent small phones
The smallest I’ve seen Sony recently releasing was the Xperia 5 V, which is 6.1". Similar to iPhone 15, S23, ZenFone and Pixel 8, just i think taller and narrower. I tried it in person, but it still felt ‘big’.
I already struggle with the keyboard on what I’d call a sizeable Android phone.
Luckily if you are looking for an even larger phone for a scaled up keyboard, you have plenty of options. I don’t have the same struggle with the keyboard, and would happily use a 4" screen phone if one were available.
Do custom ROMs such as Lineage and Postmarket OS support the fairphone 5 though?
Murena is selling the Fairphone 5 with the Lineage-based /e/OS already: https://e.foundation/leaving-apple-google-murena-fairphone-5-is-here-welcome-e-os-1-14-join-the-photo-contest-e-os-2023/
Postmarketos boots on fp5 but lots if things are not yet working. I think, the main contributor is a Fairphone employee https://wiki.postmarketos.org/wiki/Fairphone_5_(fairphone-fp5) I can’t find LineageOS development progress, but Murena look like they will be selling the fp5 with e/os which is customised LineageOS, so its probably making progress.
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How would you rate CalyxOS?
CalyxOS doesn’t support the FP5 yet but they are working on it. I have been using it for like 2 years and the only thing I miss is a sensor permission like the one from GrapheneOS.
literal liberalism, it’s putting lipstick on the pig that is android, the entire system is built from the ground up to be a surveillance nightmare. Postmarket OS should work but you’ll be better off getting a used Oneplus 6/6T and waiting for camera support (soon ™ )
Patches for the kernel that make the camera work exist, even though they haven’t been accepted into the kernel you could just compile it yourself. Maybe I’m not the best resource though, I hard bricked my 6T two days ago. Ubuntu Touch is also an option, it has camera support because it uses an older more custom kernel.
E OS does
My last fairphone died of a busted motherboard, which wasn’t replacable. Since then I am kinda sceptical about the “repairable” part.
I forget, bargaining is which stage of grief?
wasn’t it the 2nd?
The only thing that makes me cautious about this phone is the CPU. Will it still be performant in 5+ years?
I mean I’m running a FP3 from 4 years ago and literally nothing changed. Phones don’t magically get slower if they’re not filled up with bloat.
Phones don’t magically get slower
They do if you stick with the OEM’s ROM.
Technically no, the OEMs ROM is what gets slower, hence my comment about bloat.
I’m still rocking a 2017 phone, courtesy of lineage.
People are shocked how fast it is, not because it’s old (they don’t know), but because it’s faster than anything they have.
Bloat, apps running for no reason, really slow a phone down.
It felt this way for me for my last Samsung S10. Their android become an unusable mess, bloated to the brink,so I switched it to Lineage. It felt like a different phone.
That phone alone determined me to go for Pixels which allow relocking bootloader with custom roms.
Yea, Samsung was my last device that caused me to switch to AOSP and now Lineage.
Had Moto before that which was pretty good, far less bloat.
If you use your phone like 99% of people do, it will be completely fine. If you don’t do gaming or 4K video editing on your phone, there’s no problem. The CPU will even be fine for Instagram face filters for the foreseeable future
I ordered the FP5 after using my OnePlus 3T for nearly 7 years, so I imagine it’ll be OK on that front, given I’m switching only due to issues with the USB port and power button.
YMMV but for regular users it should be fine.
Not sure how the CPU compares, but I’m still running a Pixel 2 XL and the only real issue I have is the lack of RAM. CPU speed is no issue here.
