If you need coffee to have energy in the morning that is a problem for you.
And yes, coffee is a drug and it can be dangerous as well.
As Amaerica showed during the Prohibition and as we see today with opioids, humans will always want to alter their consciouness, no matter the cost. Legalizing drugs along with treating addiction as a disease and not a crime, would be a net positive.
Legalizing it encourages its consumption. There were high rates of people going to the ER with marijuana induced psychosis after legalizing in California (something where people probably would have been brought to the ER either way)
Slowing a response system clearly isn’t socially advantageous in any society where people are going to be operating any method of transportation like cars, bikes etc etc. I wouldn’t have a major opposition to it if people didn’t habitually attempt to leave the house while still high. Not to mention the consumption of it exposing others to chemicals through air pollution.
these also expose others to risk of death by explosion as gas stoves require gas pipes which blow up every so often, usually taking a few houses with it
You didn’t even include the most obvious one from San Bernardino. That one still haunts me. Luckily it happened in midday with surprisingly few casualties but a gas line blew up like a whole suburban block.
Indoor cooking serves a social purpose that marijuana doesn’t. We can’t just do away with it. As for the other things, they are already legal most places, if they were illegal I would most certainly oppose legalizing them and cigarettes should also be banned for the innocent people they kill through causing impaired driving and exposing innocent people to their smoke.
big time yeah, but so does smoking. for that matter, so does alcohol.
We can’t just do away with it.
sure we could! we can just do it outside.
ngl if all you’ve got is “well these things are legal and this one isn’t” then i’m deeply uninterested. “but it’s illegal!” okay so what? in the u.s. at least those laws were created explicitly to target and demonize black people and progressive movements. i listed the things i did bc they’re all harmful to human health in one way or another. candles put out a similar level of air pollution to smoking cigarettes inside. campfires? oh you better believe that shit is terrible for you. my point is that you’re not really being honest about the reasoning behind your beliefs. it’s okay to say “i think this should be banned because i don’t like it.” maybe nobody will agree with you! maybe they will. at least it would be truthful.
I am not using the law as a justification but rather saying that something already being socially unacceptable for the majority of people and already being illegal is easier to counteract than something that these is no base for its elimination already. It is easier to oppose something already illegal than saying we should eliminate something from scratch even if I agree with you that it ought to be eliminated long term. Smoking and alcohol do not serve the same purpose as cooking and are unnecessary and easily replaceable.
rapidly losing interest here but illegality in no way corresponds to social unacceptability. i’m not sure why you would ever make the mistake of conflating the two tbh.
Marijuana is socially unacceptable by many people outside of those in criminal circles and it’s level of acceptability can be counteracted through media and education
Indoor cooking serves a social purpose that marijuana doesn’t
So because you personally see no utility in something, nobody in society can benefit from it as they see fit. This is your reactionary boomer mind poking through. Taking selfish simplifications and extrapolating to them to everyone to enforce social control. You must recognize this is boomer behavior you are exhibiting. The exact logic is used to justify homophobia and transphobia.
Indoor cooking is a nearly universal concept that there is not an easy replacement for in the majority of cases. Eliminating marijuana is much more achievable.
if it’s so achievable then why hasn’t it been done despite the most authoritarian police state in world history with a surveillance state and billions in funding? Despite putting millions into jail for it to bring our prison population to the highest in human history?
Because keeping people as offenders makes more money. Jails aren’t designed to help stop crimes. We should be using free treatment centers and education primarily.
we banned them from HB hopefully the lemmygrad mods nuke their account too, this is such hilarious like 1930s era reactionary nonsense it’s hilarious. This motherfucker watched Reefer Madness and thought it was a documentary lol.
I used to live with someone who smoke it on a regular basis. One day I went to bed, and my room-mate stayed on the garden, smoking his joint. When I woke up, the sandwich I prepared for my breakfast was… gone.
Are you getting the full picture? An addict stole the sustenance of a poor victim, due to his illegal psychoactive substance usage! Cannabis is danger! Cannabis is steal! Don’t cannabis! Or if you do, prepare the munchies beforehand.
[To be fair with him, on the same day he prepared me a way better sandwich as apology. And it isn’t like I went to the uni hungry, at morning I just whipped up some egg farofa and problem solved.]
Who is advocating letting people drive high? Just like with alcohol, it should have a time and a place and it should be a crime to operate a vehicle under its influence.
If a substance is legal then people will drive on it. Look at it when it comes to alcohol. Drunk driving is illegal but thousands still do it constantly
Except it is effectively legal. When a group of chickens are sick a farmer will cull them. We need the same thing for these addicts. The issue is that they walk and spread the disease of addiction even after doing this
Do you want a bunch of marijuana smokers on public transit with you? Exposing others to the dangerous smoke and causing such a noxious odor? Even if you ban cars they still are too impaired for things like bikes which cannot be easily done away with.
“Mass shooters at Rep. Gabby Giffords’s constituent meeting in Tucson, Ariz. (2011), a movie theater in Aurora, Colo. (2012), the Pulse nightclub in Orlando, Fla. (2016), the First Baptist church in Sutherland Springs, Texas (2017), and Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Fla. (2018), were reported to be marijuana users.” (https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9462911/). They are apt to commit violent crimes beyond just what they do on the roads.
i think this is the only time in my life i’ve ever encountered someone who isn’t an arch conservative try to make the claim that weed contributes to sexual assault (per your argument elsewhere in the thread) and mass murder. did your parents leave you in a locked room with nothing but reefer madness for entertainment as a kid or something?
No, I look at the actual evidence that marijuana causes violence in things like domestic abuse (https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7525024/) as well as being tied to bipolar disorder and schizophrenia (https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7084484), both of which cause violent actions. I think that we should support users in trying to get off it and focus on education rather than criminalization but it is dangerous none-the-less.
So you also advocate making alchool illegal? (overwhelming evidence of alcohol contributing to violence, domestic of otherwise) Note how I wrote “contribute” and not cause.
Human behavioural problems are complicated as well as their causes. Blaming them solely on substances is dishonest and steers us away from the real causes.
We aren’t discussing alcohol. I obviously oppose it and also support criminalizing it with fierce aggression but that’s completely irrelevant to this discussion, there are many other things I also support criminalizing
correlation doesn’t equal causation. weed is very popular and used hundreds of millions of times every day, of course it will be co-existing with all the realities of the world. It doesn’t mean that it causes them.
It causes slower reaction times. People still attempt to drive/ride a bike even with alcohol so they will likely do so with marijuana. There is substantial evidence tying its usage to violence and mental illness. That is reason enough to oppose it
as someone who suffers pretty frequent migraines i can agree that it’s no fun when people are stinky in public. you don’t hear me calling for a ban on perfumes, colognes, axe body spray (showing my age here probably) etc, etc, etc.
if someone is driving while high then they should face consequences, but otherwise no crime has been committed. You can’t just do pre-crime to justify your views. Something can’t be made illegal because someone might later do something different that is illegal.
How do you prevent that? Look at alcohol and how many people drive drunk. Marijuana can remain in your system for over 24 hours (even longer possibly) and many people will drive a car/a bike/go out in public. Not to mention that marijuana is often used in sexual assaults (https://adai.uw.edu/pubs/pdf/2017mj_sexualassault.pdf). I think that users deserve treatment and support rather than just off to prison but that shouldn’t make us act like the drug is some good benefit to society.
Banning alcohol absolutely should be done and has only failed due to half-assed enforcement and lack of social support. We should be supporting addicts with treatment centers and educating on the harms. That is the best way to eliminate it.
I am not currently arguing that as that is not the subject being discussed on this post, but yes, I do support banning alcohol and think it absolutely should be a goal to eliminate all of these useless materials that lead only to death of innocent individuals, abuse, and crime.
Well no, if you wanted to keep the discussion to marijuana then you should have stuck to actual criticisms of the drug instead of criticising potential consequences of misuse, which can apply to a lot of things. Driving unimpaired also kills innocent people, do you think driving should be banned?
Can we eliminate misuse? We have to look at it in the real word and the real word shows that misuse would occur like it does with alcohol. Unless misuse could be prevented then marijuana ought to be kept illegal.
Can we eliminate the negative consequences of a war on drugs? We have to look at in the real world and the real world shows that wars on drugs create huge slave labor prison systems for victimless crimes. Unless capitalism has been abolished then drugs wars ought to be opposed
When did I say that we should oppose it in that way? I am saying that marijuana is a social ill. And that it ought to be opposed. It should be opposed by going after distributors, education, and social support for users while also aiming to disrupt the social norms that encourage it. Marijuana is and has been illegal and opposed in many AES states as well for example.
If you need marijuana to “produce insight” then that is a problem for you. It is best that we keep dangerous drugs off the street through any means.
Stop your bullshit
Stop being a junkie sympathizer
Calling someone out for spewing bullshit does not make you a sympathizer.
If you need coffee to have energy in the morning that is a problem for you.
And yes, coffee is a drug and it can be dangerous as well.
As Amaerica showed during the Prohibition and as we see today with opioids, humans will always want to alter their consciouness, no matter the cost. Legalizing drugs along with treating addiction as a disease and not a crime, would be a net positive.
Legalizing it encourages its consumption. There were high rates of people going to the ER with marijuana induced psychosis after legalizing in California (something where people probably would have been brought to the ER either way)
No, there were not. Stop your bullshit.
Stop being a junkie sympathizer
Calling someone out for spewing bullshit does not make you a sympathizer.
Bait used to be believable
Oh, everything that doesn’t conform to my world view is just “bait”
Stop your bullshit
Stop being a junkie sympathizer
Calling someone out for spewing bullshit does not make you a sympathizer.
Yes it does. You are effectively a murderer by advocating for drug addiction
dangerous? lmao
you have the worldview of a victorian era spinster
Slowing a response system clearly isn’t socially advantageous in any society where people are going to be operating any method of transportation like cars, bikes etc etc. I wouldn’t have a major opposition to it if people didn’t habitually attempt to leave the house while still high. Not to mention the consumption of it exposing others to chemicals through air pollution.
Stop your bullshit
Stop being a junkie sympathizer
Calling someone out for spewing bullshit does not make you a sympathizer.
oh hell yes now we’re talking. so you’re in favor of banning cigarettes, campfires, candles, gas stoves, and shit why not, indoor cooking too right?
these also expose others to risk of death by explosion as gas stoves require gas pipes which blow up every so often, usually taking a few houses with it
You didn’t even include the most obvious one from San Bernardino. That one still haunts me. Luckily it happened in midday with surprisingly few casualties but a gas line blew up like a whole suburban block.
Indoor cooking serves a social purpose that marijuana doesn’t. We can’t just do away with it. As for the other things, they are already legal most places, if they were illegal I would most certainly oppose legalizing them and cigarettes should also be banned for the innocent people they kill through causing impaired driving and exposing innocent people to their smoke.
big time yeah, but so does smoking. for that matter, so does alcohol.
sure we could! we can just do it outside.
ngl if all you’ve got is “well these things are legal and this one isn’t” then i’m deeply uninterested. “but it’s illegal!” okay so what? in the u.s. at least those laws were created explicitly to target and demonize black people and progressive movements. i listed the things i did bc they’re all harmful to human health in one way or another. candles put out a similar level of air pollution to smoking cigarettes inside. campfires? oh you better believe that shit is terrible for you. my point is that you’re not really being honest about the reasoning behind your beliefs. it’s okay to say “i think this should be banned because i don’t like it.” maybe nobody will agree with you! maybe they will. at least it would be truthful.
I am not using the law as a justification but rather saying that something already being socially unacceptable for the majority of people and already being illegal is easier to counteract than something that these is no base for its elimination already. It is easier to oppose something already illegal than saying we should eliminate something from scratch even if I agree with you that it ought to be eliminated long term. Smoking and alcohol do not serve the same purpose as cooking and are unnecessary and easily replaceable.
rapidly losing interest here but illegality in no way corresponds to social unacceptability. i’m not sure why you would ever make the mistake of conflating the two tbh.
Marijuana is socially unacceptable by many people outside of those in criminal circles and it’s level of acceptability can be counteracted through media and education
So because you personally see no utility in something, nobody in society can benefit from it as they see fit. This is your reactionary boomer mind poking through. Taking selfish simplifications and extrapolating to them to everyone to enforce social control. You must recognize this is boomer behavior you are exhibiting. The exact logic is used to justify homophobia and transphobia.
Indoor cooking is a nearly universal concept that there is not an easy replacement for in the majority of cases. Eliminating marijuana is much more achievable.
if it’s so achievable then why hasn’t it been done despite the most authoritarian police state in world history with a surveillance state and billions in funding? Despite putting millions into jail for it to bring our prison population to the highest in human history?
Because keeping people as offenders makes more money. Jails aren’t designed to help stop crimes. We should be using free treatment centers and education primarily.
you
Because I oppose dangerous drugs that kill people?
Stop your bullshit
we banned them from HB hopefully the lemmygrad mods nuke their account too, this is such hilarious like 1930s era reactionary nonsense it’s hilarious. This motherfucker watched Reefer Madness and thought it was a documentary lol.
Stop being a junkie sympathizer
Calling someone out for spewing bullshit does not make you a sympathizer.
Yes ANY means. We should nuke the entire planet before we let one dying grandma have a single puff.
ah yes the myriad dangers of eating too many cookies and falling asleep watching nature documentaries
this scourge must end!
You’re laughing but I’m a victim of cannabis!
I used to live with someone who smoke it on a regular basis. One day I went to bed, and my room-mate stayed on the garden, smoking his joint. When I woke up, the sandwich I prepared for my breakfast was… gone.
Are you getting the full picture? An addict stole the sustenance of a poor victim, due to his illegal psychoactive substance usage! Cannabis is danger! Cannabis is steal! Don’t cannabis!
Or if you do, prepare the munchies beforehand.[To be fair with him, on the same day he prepared me a way better sandwich as apology. And it isn’t like I went to the uni hungry, at morning I just whipped up some egg farofa and problem solved.]
The actual damage that it does do through impaired driving causes actual damage through killing innocent people as well as contributes to laziness.
Who is advocating letting people drive high? Just like with alcohol, it should have a time and a place and it should be a crime to operate a vehicle under its influence.
If a substance is legal then people will drive on it. Look at it when it comes to alcohol. Drunk driving is illegal but thousands still do it constantly
They are driving under it even if it is illegal. The legality won’t change that.
Except it is effectively legal. When a group of chickens are sick a farmer will cull them. We need the same thing for these addicts. The issue is that they walk and spread the disease of addiction even after doing this
distracted driving impairs your ability to operate a vehicle significantly, better ban
talking topassengers!or you know. just invest in public transit instead and ban cars.
Do you want a bunch of marijuana smokers on public transit with you? Exposing others to the dangerous smoke and causing such a noxious odor? Even if you ban cars they still are too impaired for things like bikes which cannot be easily done away with.
“Mass shooters at Rep. Gabby Giffords’s constituent meeting in Tucson, Ariz. (2011), a movie theater in Aurora, Colo. (2012), the Pulse nightclub in Orlando, Fla. (2016), the First Baptist church in Sutherland Springs, Texas (2017), and Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Fla. (2018), were reported to be marijuana users.” (https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9462911/). They are apt to commit violent crimes beyond just what they do on the roads.
i think this is the only time in my life i’ve ever encountered someone who isn’t an arch conservative try to make the claim that weed contributes to sexual assault (per your argument elsewhere in the thread) and mass murder. did your parents leave you in a locked room with nothing but reefer madness for entertainment as a kid or something?
No, I look at the actual evidence that marijuana causes violence in things like domestic abuse (https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7525024/) as well as being tied to bipolar disorder and schizophrenia (https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7084484), both of which cause violent actions. I think that we should support users in trying to get off it and focus on education rather than criminalization but it is dangerous none-the-less.
So you also advocate making alchool illegal? (overwhelming evidence of alcohol contributing to violence, domestic of otherwise) Note how I wrote “contribute” and not cause.
Human behavioural problems are complicated as well as their causes. Blaming them solely on substances is dishonest and steers us away from the real causes.
We aren’t discussing alcohol. I obviously oppose it and also support criminalizing it with fierce aggression but that’s completely irrelevant to this discussion, there are many other things I also support criminalizing
correlation doesn’t equal causation. weed is very popular and used hundreds of millions of times every day, of course it will be co-existing with all the realities of the world. It doesn’t mean that it causes them.
It causes slower reaction times. People still attempt to drive/ride a bike even with alcohol so they will likely do so with marijuana. There is substantial evidence tying its usage to violence and mental illness. That is reason enough to oppose it
Sib please get on a fucking bus once in your life. You are not allowed to smoke on them, marijuana or no.
When I am on trains or subways there are often other passengers with smoke on their clothes, this is still terrible.
as someone who suffers pretty frequent migraines i can agree that it’s no fun when people are stinky in public. you don’t hear me calling for a ban on perfumes, colognes, axe body spray (showing my age here probably) etc, etc, etc.
I’m calling for a ban on axe, even if you won’t. That shit is for awkward middle school dances, and nothing else
If the smell was the only issue I would agree with you but marijuana causes violence and death in a way that those don’t
Yes, so does lack of sleep. Put anyone in jail who pulls an all nighter
That is much harder to regulate. If someone is driving while tired then they also should be facing other sanctions.
if someone is driving while high then they should face consequences, but otherwise no crime has been committed. You can’t just do pre-crime to justify your views. Something can’t be made illegal because someone might later do something different that is illegal.
How do you prevent that? Look at alcohol and how many people drive drunk. Marijuana can remain in your system for over 24 hours (even longer possibly) and many people will drive a car/a bike/go out in public. Not to mention that marijuana is often used in sexual assaults (https://adai.uw.edu/pubs/pdf/2017mj_sexualassault.pdf). I think that users deserve treatment and support rather than just off to prison but that shouldn’t make us act like the drug is some good benefit to society.
Then ban alcohol. I’d love to see you try and eat shit the same way they did a hundred years ago when you developed your worldview
Banning alcohol absolutely should be done and has only failed due to half-assed enforcement and lack of social support. We should be supporting addicts with treatment centers and educating on the harms. That is the best way to eliminate it.
So you’re also arguing alcohol should be banned?
I am not currently arguing that as that is not the subject being discussed on this post, but yes, I do support banning alcohol and think it absolutely should be a goal to eliminate all of these useless materials that lead only to death of innocent individuals, abuse, and crime.
Well no, if you wanted to keep the discussion to marijuana then you should have stuck to actual criticisms of the drug instead of criticising potential consequences of misuse, which can apply to a lot of things. Driving unimpaired also kills innocent people, do you think driving should be banned?
Can we eliminate misuse? We have to look at it in the real word and the real word shows that misuse would occur like it does with alcohol. Unless misuse could be prevented then marijuana ought to be kept illegal.
Can we eliminate the negative consequences of a war on drugs? We have to look at in the real world and the real world shows that wars on drugs create huge slave labor prison systems for victimless crimes. Unless capitalism has been abolished then drugs wars ought to be opposed
When did I say that we should oppose it in that way? I am saying that marijuana is a social ill. And that it ought to be opposed. It should be opposed by going after distributors, education, and social support for users while also aiming to disrupt the social norms that encourage it. Marijuana is and has been illegal and opposed in many AES states as well for example.