Germany is weighing sweeping pension changes, including raising the retirement age to 70. Meanwhile, football fans are celebrating after the men's national side qualified for the World Cup knockout stage.
if we retire earlier we miss some time during which we built our retirement fund
What? If the worker gets a fair share of the productivity gains, they have higher salaries. They can put more in their retirement fund and could work less.
See that graph:
Productivity gains vs. salaries. That is what was stolen since the mid-seventies. Salaries, on average, should be double as high. You could basically set aside one month of living per month (and earn interest on it). Where did the monetary gains go instead? Into assets of the wealthy, they just did not vanish under mysterious circumstances.
People just underestimate how hard they got robbed, if they even consider that they were robbed, that is.
Tax the rich ? Right. Let’s make an example
Let’s make a better example. Why only 10 billion per year? Like, the private assets of German citizens are estimated around 5-6 trillion Euro. If we estimate like 6% interest (long-term gains on the financial market, evan higher the last few years, but granted, it’s hot), that is 320 billion capital gains alone, per year. Take a meager 10% and you have 32 billion already, or you could go harder, why not? After all people still earn money.
Take as an example the Quandt family: they “earn” 500 million cash(!) on BMW dividends alone, but pay less than 1% tax on those earnings. Why do I pay like 32% on average on my income from work, while they almost pay nothing for doing nothing?
Tax inheritance accordingly. People can inherit like 100 million and never have to think about anything in their life. Why should they inherit billions?
100 billion estimated losses through tax evasion estimated in Germany, each year.
If we do all that, and still cannot afford less work for everybody, OK, I am convinced then. But not before the rich get taxed properly.
how we are approaching a similar scenario
I don’t know, have you looked around? Public infrastructure crumbles, people cannot afford basic necessities anymore. Funnily enough prime “Wirtschaftswunder” was in the sixeties, the rubble already gone.
Except production is no more here
Investments by the state are usually very locally sourced, as the state pays workers here, or invests in infrastructure. You buy flatscreens in China, allright, but you build streets, railways, bridges and public pools right here.
For the first or second year, then the rich would have nothing more or, more probable, moved their money out of your reach
It’s not like there’s nothing you could do against that. Tax duties come with citizenship, like the U.S. does. Tax when people shift their assets away. A lot of assets cannot be shifted anyway. Look at the Schwartz or Abrecht families. Their assets are like thousands of supermarkets. Can they just pack them up and move them elsewhere? I doubt it.
What? If the worker gets a fair share of the productivity gains, they have higher salaries. They can put more in their retirement fund and could work less.
Ok, so put some numbers: how much more should one be paid to be able to retire, say, 5 years earlier and have a longer retirement period (Eu life expecanty, on average, is 82) ? Obviously you need to consider the same standards of living.
People just underestimate how hard they got robbed, if they even consider that they were robbed, that is.
Or simply understand that it is not possible to have it all.
Let’s make a better example. Why only 10 billion per year?
Two reasons (based on Italian data):
you want to tax only the rich (but we should define rich)
if you go at 100, you are taxing the rich at about the 5% of GDP and it do not seems a good idea.
Like, the private assets of German citizens are estimated around 5-6 trillion Euro. If we estimate like 6% interest (long-term gains on the financial market, evan higher the last few years, but granted, it’s hot), that is 320 billion capital gains alone, per year. Take a meager 10% and you have 32 billion already, or you could go harder, why not? After all people still earn money.
True, but that include the private assets of everyone, not only the rich, so it is a value you cannot consider. Moreover, even considering these numbers, you end with about 1700 euro a year for every retired, even less if you increase the number of retirees.
Tax inheritance accordingly. People can inherit like 100 million and never have to think about anything in their life. Why should they inherit billions?
Inheritance tax is the most outrageous tax imaginable in my opinion. Moreover, these billions are (or should be) already taxed, you are not creating anything new when you inherit something. You are paying for your grief basically.
100 billion estimated losses through tax evasion estimated in Germany, each year.
Then maybe, before going to a war to tax the few rich, recover every euro from tax evasion. And I bet that the vast majority is not from the rich
If we do all that, and still cannot afford less work for everybody, OK, I am convinced then. But not before the rich get taxed properly.
You never put numbers on your ideas.
I don’t know, have you looked around? Public infrastructure crumbles, people cannot afford basic necessities anymore.
Yes, and I also see people who actively fight against new infrastructures so ?
Investments by the state are usually very locally sourced, as the state pays workers here, or invests in infrastructure. You buy flatscreens in China, allright, but you build streets, railways, bridges and public pools right here.
Ok, but at some point you will run out of new streets, bridges and railways to build. Ok, there will be maintenance but at some point in time the state has to stop.
Public investments are a nice short term solution but nothing a state can sustain on a long period.
What you would need is local production, so build the flatscreens locally so people have a work and could pay for something else, also build locally.
Have you noted that these problems started in the exact same moment the production were moved in cheaper countries ?
For the first or second year, then the rich would have nothing more or, more probable, moved their money out of your reach
It’s not like there’s nothing you could do against that. Tax duties come with citizenship, like the U.S. does.
Let me explain you how rich people are rich. It is not because they have billions on their personal bank account. But since they have shares of company that are valued billions (which is a hypothetical value anyway) they can go to a bank and say “look, I own shares in a company that are valued at 2 billions, can you lend me 100 million secured by these shares ?” Then they simply pay back the debt. And debt generally is not taxed.
BTW, you can renounce citizenship.
Tax when people shift their assets away. A lot of assets cannot be shifted anyway.
Work only the first time. Once I shift my assets outside your country, you have no way to reach them.
And I bet there are dozens of legal ways to protect my assets once they are out. And even more illegal way hard to prove or discover.
Look at the Schwartz or Abrecht families. Their assets are like thousands of supermarkets. Can they just pack them up and move them elsewhere? I doubt it.
Carrefour exited the Italian market: the simply sold the supermarkets (sometime at a loss) and now in Italy they have pretty nothing (just a smaller office that handle the brand, for now). And they paid nothing since they earn nothing in Italy.
They can simply do the same thing and then move their money to another country. Or they can simply close them.
It is a myth that since you have something physical then you cannot get rid of it.
What? If the worker gets a fair share of the productivity gains, they have higher salaries. They can put more in their retirement fund and could work less.
See that graph:
Productivity gains vs. salaries. That is what was stolen since the mid-seventies. Salaries, on average, should be double as high. You could basically set aside one month of living per month (and earn interest on it). Where did the monetary gains go instead? Into assets of the wealthy, they just did not vanish under mysterious circumstances.
People just underestimate how hard they got robbed, if they even consider that they were robbed, that is.
Let’s make a better example. Why only 10 billion per year? Like, the private assets of German citizens are estimated around 5-6 trillion Euro. If we estimate like 6% interest (long-term gains on the financial market, evan higher the last few years, but granted, it’s hot), that is 320 billion capital gains alone, per year. Take a meager 10% and you have 32 billion already, or you could go harder, why not? After all people still earn money.
Take as an example the Quandt family: they “earn” 500 million cash(!) on BMW dividends alone, but pay less than 1% tax on those earnings. Why do I pay like 32% on average on my income from work, while they almost pay nothing for doing nothing?
Tax inheritance accordingly. People can inherit like 100 million and never have to think about anything in their life. Why should they inherit billions?
100 billion estimated losses through tax evasion estimated in Germany, each year.
If we do all that, and still cannot afford less work for everybody, OK, I am convinced then. But not before the rich get taxed properly.
I don’t know, have you looked around? Public infrastructure crumbles, people cannot afford basic necessities anymore. Funnily enough prime “Wirtschaftswunder” was in the sixeties, the rubble already gone.
Investments by the state are usually very locally sourced, as the state pays workers here, or invests in infrastructure. You buy flatscreens in China, allright, but you build streets, railways, bridges and public pools right here.
It’s not like there’s nothing you could do against that. Tax duties come with citizenship, like the U.S. does. Tax when people shift their assets away. A lot of assets cannot be shifted anyway. Look at the Schwartz or Abrecht families. Their assets are like thousands of supermarkets. Can they just pack them up and move them elsewhere? I doubt it.
Ok, so put some numbers: how much more should one be paid to be able to retire, say, 5 years earlier and have a longer retirement period (Eu life expecanty, on average, is 82) ? Obviously you need to consider the same standards of living.
Or simply understand that it is not possible to have it all.
Two reasons (based on Italian data):
True, but that include the private assets of everyone, not only the rich, so it is a value you cannot consider. Moreover, even considering these numbers, you end with about 1700 euro a year for every retired, even less if you increase the number of retirees.
Inheritance tax is the most outrageous tax imaginable in my opinion. Moreover, these billions are (or should be) already taxed, you are not creating anything new when you inherit something. You are paying for your grief basically.
Then maybe, before going to a war to tax the few rich, recover every euro from tax evasion. And I bet that the vast majority is not from the rich
You never put numbers on your ideas.
Yes, and I also see people who actively fight against new infrastructures so ?
Ok, but at some point you will run out of new streets, bridges and railways to build. Ok, there will be maintenance but at some point in time the state has to stop.
Public investments are a nice short term solution but nothing a state can sustain on a long period.
What you would need is local production, so build the flatscreens locally so people have a work and could pay for something else, also build locally.
Have you noted that these problems started in the exact same moment the production were moved in cheaper countries ?
Let me explain you how rich people are rich. It is not because they have billions on their personal bank account. But since they have shares of company that are valued billions (which is a hypothetical value anyway) they can go to a bank and say “look, I own shares in a company that are valued at 2 billions, can you lend me 100 million secured by these shares ?” Then they simply pay back the debt. And debt generally is not taxed.
BTW, you can renounce citizenship.
Work only the first time. Once I shift my assets outside your country, you have no way to reach them.
And I bet there are dozens of legal ways to protect my assets once they are out. And even more illegal way hard to prove or discover.
Carrefour exited the Italian market: the simply sold the supermarkets (sometime at a loss) and now in Italy they have pretty nothing (just a smaller office that handle the brand, for now). And they paid nothing since they earn nothing in Italy.
They can simply do the same thing and then move their money to another country. Or they can simply close them.
It is a myth that since you have something physical then you cannot get rid of it.