On the side bar it lists the following:

  • [Matrix/Element]Dead
  • Discord

“Discord” is an active link, but the Matrix link is completely inactive. Not only is it inactive (which could have be excused as a broken link), but it is also manually labeled as “Dead”, as if there is no intention of making it work. How can a community that is focused on privacy willingly favor a service that is privacy non-respecting when a perfectly functional privacy-respecting alternative exists?

    • 👁️👄👁️@lemm.ee
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      11 months ago

      Yeah it quickly becomes a dick measuring contest and shunning people for using different things. It becomes very black/white views, and have some crazy out of touch takes, like expecting your grandma to self host lol. They also confuse anonymity with privacy, like how not being able to sign up for something with tor and monero is a privacy violation, it’s not.

      • funnystuff97@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        I think it falls into the same pitfalls as most super niche communities, like a lot of subreddits did.

        For example, the shaving subreddit (/r/wicked_edge I think?). Its mission statement was to introduce people to cleaner, safer, and more efficient shaving methods. And for the most part, with all of its resources and wikis, it successfully did it. But if you choose to stay after you’ve made your informed purchases, the posts were mostly braggarts showing off their latest hundreds-of-dollars handles, supreme razor blades, brushes made from actual gold, that sort of thing. My point is, the average person (by my guess, like 90% of people going to the site) gets the information they need and then never participate in the community again. But those who stay are those who really want to stay– people who are most likely to brag and boast. So over time, it falls more and more into plain old dick measuring contests.

        This obviously isn’t true of all communities, but I think it’s a common pitfall for a lot of them. I can imagine privacy is very similar: take all the steps you can to learn to protect your privacy, and then… you’re good, for the most part.

        • online@lemmy.ml
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          11 months ago

          Wow this is great I am surprised to see people talking about this (let alone even being aware of it).

          Really refreshing to not have it to be a contest to follow random dogmas.

          Lemmy is refreshingly smarter than I was used to seeing on Reddit.

          • Welt@lazysoci.al
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            11 months ago

            Just a slightly higher barrier to entry really filters out the low-quality ignorant/belligerent/unconstructive posters, don’t you think? The relative absence of useless posts made either by bots or unhelpful users is refreshing too. It’s not perfect but it’s a huge step in the right direction.

          • denkrishna@sh.itjust.works
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            4 months ago

            Hahahaha

            Not have it be a contest to follow random dogmas

            Lemmy is refreshingly smarter than… reddit

            I don’t know if this was intentional or not, but either way this was hilarious!!

        • evranch@lemmy.ca
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          11 months ago

          Reminds me of what happened to the pipe tobacco sub after Reddit banned trading of tobacco.

          What had been a thriving sub of trading, sharing, well written reviews and friendly discussion quickly became stagnant and started leaning towards people showing off their expensive pipes and tobacco orders. Without the people who came for the trading and stayed to chat, the sub became boring quickly.

      • MiddledAgedGuy@beehaw.org
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        11 months ago

        Pfft. My gramgram self-hosts on her own LFS build with a hardened kernel and custom written SELinux policies. All your grandparents need to get on her level.

        Disclaimer: Everything here is a lie.

      • AtmaJnana@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        it quickly becomes a dick measuring contest and shunning people for using different things. It becomes very black/white views, and have some crazy out of touch takes

        In other words, it’s just like literally every online community in the history of the Internet. When Sir TimBL created the first web page, people probably used it to bitch about how everyone else was doing it wrong.

    • FeelzGoodMan420@eviltoast.org
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      11 months ago

      Lol this is 100% the truth. Privacy communities are a fucking meme. 99% of posts are just people circlejerking about Firefox vs Brave.

      • clanginator@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        I’ve never gotten why Brave got popular in the first place. I downloaded it once and uninstalled within 3 minutes.

        Cromite and Waterfox are all I’ll ever need.

        • FeelzGoodMan420@eviltoast.org
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          11 months ago

          Idk and I don’t care. Just tired of watching the Brave circlejerk. Like everyone knows that company is sketchy as absolute shit. If you still want to use the browser then that’s on you. But I’m tired of seeing people screaming about it in every one of these threads lol

    • Damage@feddit.it
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      11 months ago

      I don’t understand why it’s so popular… It’s a fancy IRC that’s centralized by a single company

      • Amju Wolf@pawb.social
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        11 months ago

        Because it has significantly more features than IRC and it’s dead simple to spin up your own “server” where you aren’t beholden much to “admins” or whatever.

      • DrQuint@lemm.ee
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        11 months ago

        fancy IRC

        IRC was already “caveman playing with sticks and pebbles” a decade before discord became a thing. It’s really not a good point of comparison and questioning.

        Discord became popular for one simple reason: anyone could make a server, share it with a crossplatform link, and others could then try out that link without installing anything. In other words, it became popular because it literally copied Slack and because the Skype era was atrociously bad customization and ease of use-wise compared to the preceding.

      • folkrav@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        Every time I see Slack/Discord et Al. described as such, I wonder if any of these people actually used any of those. By use, I mean actually try out its features, not just treating it as IRC (“just” channels, messages and DMs for text convos).

        I hate Discord with a passion, but pretending like it’s just “fancy IRC” is IMHO pretty absurd.

      • zeekaran@sopuli.xyz
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        11 months ago

        If you legitimately don’t understand why it’s popular, you are seriously out of touch.

      • rbits@lemm.ee
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        11 months ago
        • Better moderation tools
        • Easier to do voice/video channels
        • Easy to create your own server
        • Huge amount of useful bots created by the community
        • Features like replies, threads, onboarding screens, and custom emotes

        Don’t get me wrong, I wish that we could use a FOSS platform instead of Discord, but 1: people are already using Discord and it’s hard to get everyone to switch platform, and 2: there is no comparable alternative right now

      • kratoz29@lemm.ee
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        11 months ago

        I use it because some of my favorite games for the Nintendo DS that has Wiimmfi support use it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

        Too hard to regrow the, already tiny user base in those cases.

  • gasull@lemmy.ml
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    11 months ago

    Most cryptocurrency communities use Discord or Telegram. It’s such an embarrasment.

    • HiramFromTheChi@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      I’ve never understood this either, given the whole notion and enthusiasm behind decentralization. I get the trade-offs regarding privacy, security, and convenience, but if you’re really tryna start a movement, and you really believe in the concept and principles of something like cryptocurrency, it seems like your communities and communication channels should also reflect similar values.

      • Chunk@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        Crypto enthusiasts don’t really care or understand decentralization. If you talk to crypto bros you will realize pretty quickly that a lot of them are very very low IQ morons.

        I was at an event and met a crypto bro. He tried to explain to a group of us that btc is like moss and the world is the forest. A couple people legitimately “got it” and began to get excited about crypto.

        • corvus@lemmy.ml
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          11 months ago

          Crypto enthusiasts don’t really care or understand decentralization.

          I wouldn’t criticize others for their low IQ while making such a dumb generalization.

      • セリャスト@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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        11 months ago

        And that’s where you realize that them defending decentralization is just trying to have a nice-sounding argument instead of assuming their dreams of getting rich with new tech

      • HardenedSteel@monero.town
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        11 months ago

        you don’t trade off your security, instead you increase it.

        for Bitcoin you can increase your privacy with various tools like coinjoin and lightning network with convenience tradeoff

        or you just use Monero.

        If you have questions feel free to ask in Monero@monero.town

    • HardenedSteel@monero.town
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      11 months ago

      You should check privacy coin Monero.

      Matrix and XMPP is pretty much popular in XMR community

      And often discord and telegram channels are bridged with other platforms.

    • rbits@lemm.ee
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      11 months ago

      Oh I hate communities that use Telegram. I mean, sure, I guess there’s better privacy, but Telegram was just not built for that. Messages always get lost, and there are no channels, which means no info channel, so they have to try and cram everything into the description.

    • Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml
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      11 months ago

      Should be telling the only two services they use is one infamous for fuck tons of child grooming and one infamous for fuck tons of terrorism.

  • 𝕽𝖚𝖆𝖎𝖉𝖍𝖗𝖎𝖌𝖍@midwest.social
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    11 months ago

    I’ve used the Discord bridge before; it works pretty well, and allows Matrix users to practice better (identity & tracking) privacy if they want. There is none, in Discord.

    It does require (a) the Discord community admin to allow the bridge, and (b) some playing with configuration of the bridge to get banning working.

    The biggest issue with Matrix is how privacy-respecting it is. Any public forum with anonymous account creation is subject to spam bots, and requires more work by admins. The biggest complaint about the bridge, and why so many Discord admins do not allow it, is because it greatly increases the spam they have to deal with. Kicking and blocking do work fine through the bridge, but it’s still a distraction requiring constant vigilance.

    Matrix needs better admin tools (where have we heard that before?) Mjolnir is good, but the freely hosted instance was shut down a year or so ago, so it’s not available to casual users. And taking on running a service just for a community bridge is a silly requirement.

    My points are, that it’s not an either-or, but that it requires work. It’s a question of commitment, not possibility. c/privacy could have a Matrix-first, privacy-friendly approach and still offer Discord for privacy casuals; it’s just harder.

  • Neps@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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    11 months ago

    People who dislike discord and want a good alternative besides matrix should check out revolt.chat <3

  • 1984@lemmy.today
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    11 months ago

    Because conversations about increasing privacy doesn’t need to be private. It’s usually about learning about other tools and that they exist.

    • Omniraptor@lemm.ee
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      11 months ago

      This only makes sense if discord is a common entry point into the community which seems unlikely to me

      • Gestrid@lemmy.ca
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        11 months ago

        It probably isn’t, but it’s probably a good place to get a quick answer about something.

  • Sir_Kevin@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    11 months ago

    A majority stake of Discord is owned by Tencent, which is a Chinese data collection company required by law to pass personal user information to the CCP. Discord runs on an unencrypted network.

    I’m just stating some facts. Make your own judgement call.

    • Zastyion345@lemmy.ml
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      11 months ago

      This, discord saying no to Microsoft’s offer to buy them out few years back shows they know what they got.

        • DefinitelyNotAPenguin@kbin.run
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          11 months ago

          Again, I just don’t understand what you mean by this, there’s a list of servers, you click one and get a list of channels in that server, click one of those and you’ve got a classic chatroom.

          What is it you find chaotic?

          • berg@lemm.ee
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            11 months ago

            When I started out with discord I felt like such a boomer. Four years in it’s a breeze, until I made my own server, then it was a few weeks back with the boomer feel.

            If you’re coming from mumble/ventrilo or such, there’s quite a bit to learn imo. Especially if you never used skype or the like, and were used to IRC. Or I’m just a boomer…

            • EngineerGaming@feddit.nl
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              11 months ago

              IRC-dwelling Gen Z here. Discord is an abomination. Not to mention that it’s apparently not very friendly to third-party clients, while the official one as well as browser version is very heavy. Like, “a third of what my whole OS consumes” heavy.

              Left Discord a while ago, no regrets.

    • QuazarOmega@lemy.lol
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      11 months ago

      Funny, I feel the same way about Matrix clients, instead. They’re not that bad, but they could use quite a bit of polish (and they also don’t rake in millions a year, so it’s not an exactly fair comparison).
      I guess it just comes down to what you’re used to

  • ngn@lemy.lol
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    11 months ago

    “discussing privacy on discord” that should be a joke anyways i created privacy@conference.jabbers.one so join if you want

  • azenyr@lemmy.world
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    11 months ago

    Because privacy and convenience are two extreme opposites and you can only go so far in the privacy direction before you start losing everything. Discord just works a million times better as a public forum/community than Matrix and is much more easily accessible to everyone.

    There is a limit. I am privacy conscious but I still use all Google Services for example, because they actually provide me with a better web, work, mobile and entertainment experiences. Similarly, I prefer Discord for big communities with channels, server bots and topics, over Matrix.

    Edit: all those people saying we can’t be privacy conscious and use Google Services at the same time: yes you can. Their services literally make my life better so I will keep using them, but I keep what I share with them to the absolute minimum. I go into their settings and disable everything I can about tracking and ads personalization (even if they still track me, I do my best not to be). You can surely still be privacy conscious using non-private products. Being extremist is not how you convince average joes to think about privacy, nor by telling them to give up all they use for unknown (for them) alternatives.

    • jackalope@lemmy.ml
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      11 months ago

      Matrix is pretty convenient. They’ve got a great mobile and web app experience.

      What exactly does discord have that mateix doesn’t? They both have threading, replies, reacts, etc.

        • BeatTakeshi@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          How and who is addressing this at large scale? I mean uptake of foss vs proprietary, privacy compliant vs not etc… It’s the same story for signal vs WhatsApp, when one sees the majority of relatives using WhatsApp, s/he would then drop signal altogether or keep it alongside for the one geek that uses it. I am in this situation and it defeats me that not much people care and chose convenience over concerns that I find legitimately vital, or in any case not trivial. I quit using Facebook/Instagram 2 years ago seeing what it does to society and am better off mentally, but the interactions I have through mastodon and pixelfed are zero, although my meta pages are still up with these links

    • ngn@lemy.lol
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      11 months ago

      i dont think anyone using google services is “privacy conscious”

      • utopiah@lemmy.ml
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        11 months ago

        Well they’re privacy “conscious” but still feel trapped. IMHO the first sentence is even more telling namely “privacy and convenience are two extreme opposites” as a justification. It’s not necessarily true, namely one can use… well pretty much anything BUT Google or Meta product and have a perfectly convenient experience. They are just used to it, so amalgamating what they are used to to what is objectively convenient for all.

        Maybe some day in the near future they will decide to go from being conscious to active about it and I can tell in advance, they are going to feel a lot better, but it requires more than introspection, it requires action.