They were warned multiple times that their platform was being used to fan the flames of a genocide, yet they did nothing. And their algorithm is designed to spread whatever gets the most engagement, which is usually hateful things.
What a ridiculous argument. They’re not saying big tech companies are necessarily as abusive as those other organisations, they’re saying people might want to avoid them in the same way.
By contrast your comment, intentionally or otherwise, suggests the only valid reason to avoid interacting with an organisation is if you were literally raped by them. Now that is fucked up.
Which group, institution or ideology specifically are you talking about? Genuinely curious. Cause I can’t think of any that are the same or worse than fb/google/etc. That are supported here. Doesn’t mean they don’t exist, ofc, I’m just unaware, hence the question, would you give me some examples?
We just don’t want history repeating itself like what happened with xmpp. Do you really think facebook of all companies is joining the fediverse with good intentions? Do you really think they’re not trying to monopolize this?
XMPP still exists - and I use it for chatting with one person. Nobody I know uses it. Techies I know use IRC and, more recently, Matrix. Or discord, disappointingly enough.
And I mention techies because the rest of the world is just happy with WhatsApp/Messenger/Slack et al.
What I’m getting at is that XMPP feels pretty dead in my experience. But who knows, maybe it would be in this same position regardless of Google like you allude to.
Do you think this is Threads’ final form? Embrace, extend, extinguish. This is what corporations do. Everything is a zero sum game in their minds, and they will act in the best interest of shareholders. That shit has no business here.
I was going to reply but you nailed it. Its about outmaneuvering smaller competitors and controlling the marketplace, and then harvesting user data for profit.
What point was that? If you don’t join Threads, they don’t have your data. They do have everything you publish to the Fediverse though, no matter what you do.
This critique of “user choice means that every instance should try and be as open as possible and try and federate with as many compatible entities as possible, so that any user, from any instance, might find and interact with content from everywhere” is as valid for instances blocking Threads as it is for blocking instances for allowing hate speech and bot-boosted corporate ads.
Personally, I prefer those to be blocked and have “user choice” mean users choosing to participate and promote the instances they believe are more useful, because my “user choice” is “I don’t want all kinds of bullshit to arrive unfiltered at my feed”.
So many people here are acting like lions, jaguars, attack zebras etc don’t exist. There is no way on this earth that meta is coming into the fediverse with good intentions. Just because we advocate for FOSS doesn’t mean we have to be foolish and vulnerable. Being closed to meta is consistent with being supportive of FOSS, because make no mistake, meta is here to kill the fediverse.
You don’t allow nazi clubs in your area? Ah hah! Gotcha! So much for the “tolerant left”!
🙄
Seriously, why are there so many people ignorant of the damage Facebook has done not only to social media, but to democracy as a whole? You’re aware of Facebooks role in Trump’s election in 2016, aren’t you? Haven’t you heard of Cambridge Analytica? Of the Russian troll farms? Of the millions of fake Republican Facebook accounts?
(Sometimes I wonder: Is Lemmy getting filled with shills, or are people THAT clueless? Has the pandemic suddenly affected our long term memory or something?)
Yes, I’m aware. Fediverse also has nazis, they’re everywhere. I can put on my big boy pants and block them as I see them, instead of an admin doing collateral damage and preventing from talking to all the other people who won’t leave Threads.
. I can put on my big boy pants and block them as I see them, instead of an admin doing collateral damage and preventing
Okay first, you have no fucking idea how online harassment works. I’ve seen numerous cases of people being attacked, even doxxed, hy hordes of assholes. Imagine a single mother who can barely have time to work and attend their children, to deal with this shit. And you know? It happens ALL THE TIME to BIPOC users on the fedi.
“Hey, the nazis are invading Poland, why aren’t you on the frontlines carrying your gun?” As if there wasn no such thing as innocent CIVILIANS. In a world where speaking up is punished by dogpiling, harassing and doxxing, people just prefer to flee because their admins don’t do shit to defend them. Ask ANY Black person on Mastodon what it’s like to be harassed online.
Second, forcing people deal with the problems of harassment puts the burden of blocking on the end user. (From another POV, it’s the e-mail spam problem if you think about it. Dogpiling is a social form of DDOSing someone, and there’s no way to prevent it except by mass blocking the source of the attacks.
Letting an instance admin defederate from a problematic instance protects ALL the admin’s users with minimal effort on their part. If a threads user is defederated they can as well switch to another instance, nobody stops them.
Are they not happy with how their instance is treated? Demand changes to the instance, after all they paid for it, didn’t they? Oh they didn’t? Then who’s finacing and controlling it then?
Consider defederation the invisible hand of the market turned visible.
Defederation is NOT damage. On the other hand, people suffering emotional distress from harassment IS damage.
FOSS bros: we’re all about user choice!
also FOSS bros: no not like that
It’s pretty logical actually: The advocates of openness must be closed to one thing, and that is whatever aims to destroy openness itself.
Social Contract.
Exactly.
This is like inviting the Catholic church in an institution specifically built to protect former victims of same and similar institutions.
Given that anyone can start an instance and federate with Threads, or join an instance that does, freedom of choice is unaffected.
deleted by creator
Meta is partially responsible for genocide, so it’s not actually that much of a stretch, honestly.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
partially responsible for genocide
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
deleted by creator
They were warned multiple times that their platform was being used to fan the flames of a genocide, yet they did nothing. And their algorithm is designed to spread whatever gets the most engagement, which is usually hateful things.
What a ridiculous argument. They’re not saying big tech companies are necessarily as abusive as those other organisations, they’re saying people might want to avoid them in the same way.
By contrast your comment, intentionally or otherwise, suggests the only valid reason to avoid interacting with an organisation is if you were literally raped by them. Now that is fucked up.
deleted by creator
Which group, institution or ideology specifically are you talking about? Genuinely curious. Cause I can’t think of any that are the same or worse than fb/google/etc. That are supported here. Doesn’t mean they don’t exist, ofc, I’m just unaware, hence the question, would you give me some examples?
We just don’t want history repeating itself like what happened with xmpp. Do you really think facebook of all companies is joining the fediverse with good intentions? Do you really think they’re not trying to monopolize this?
I would like to point out that xmpp still exists. Google Talk does not. WhatsApp killed xmpp, not Google
XMPP still exists - and I use it for chatting with one person. Nobody I know uses it. Techies I know use IRC and, more recently, Matrix. Or discord, disappointingly enough.
And I mention techies because the rest of the world is just happy with WhatsApp/Messenger/Slack et al.
What I’m getting at is that XMPP feels pretty dead in my experience. But who knows, maybe it would be in this same position regardless of Google like you allude to.
I never mentioned google. And sure, xmpp exists but it’s dead and would be much better off if not for big tech giants
Last I checked, the people using XMPP are still running happily using servers and clients.
All 17 of them.
I gotta ask… were you around and actively using xmpp around that time?
Because I was. And xmpp struggling had nothing to do with Google
You’re downplaying your own part, in between those two statements.
Edit: spelling
How is Threads going to breach your privacy by federating with your instance? How is de federating from Threads going to protect your privacy?
Do you think this is Threads’ final form? Embrace, extend, extinguish. This is what corporations do. Everything is a zero sum game in their minds, and they will act in the best interest of shareholders. That shit has no business here.
I was going to reply but you nailed it. Its about outmaneuvering smaller competitors and controlling the marketplace, and then harvesting user data for profit.
They can already harvest the data. Nothing on the ActivityPub is private
Sure, ignore my actual point. This is getting monotonous; enjoy Threads.
What point was that? If you don’t join Threads, they don’t have your data. They do have everything you publish to the Fediverse though, no matter what you do.
Buddy…
Work on your reading retention instead of plastering your one-note hot take all over the convo. This exchange is over.
Someone failed ethics class really hard.
This critique of “user choice means that every instance should try and be as open as possible and try and federate with as many compatible entities as possible, so that any user, from any instance, might find and interact with content from everywhere” is as valid for instances blocking Threads as it is for blocking instances for allowing hate speech and bot-boosted corporate ads.
Personally, I prefer those to be blocked and have “user choice” mean users choosing to participate and promote the instances they believe are more useful, because my “user choice” is “I don’t want all kinds of bullshit to arrive unfiltered at my feed”.
So many people here are acting like lions, jaguars, attack zebras etc don’t exist. There is no way on this earth that meta is coming into the fediverse with good intentions. Just because we advocate for FOSS doesn’t mean we have to be foolish and vulnerable. Being closed to meta is consistent with being supportive of FOSS, because make no mistake, meta is here to kill the fediverse.
relevant xkcd my friend ;) The fediverse is still open.
Yeah, can’t expect people in power not to use it to further their agenda.
You just sounded like:
🙄
Seriously, why are there so many people ignorant of the damage Facebook has done not only to social media, but to democracy as a whole? You’re aware of Facebooks role in Trump’s election in 2016, aren’t you? Haven’t you heard of Cambridge Analytica? Of the Russian troll farms? Of the millions of fake Republican Facebook accounts?
(Sometimes I wonder: Is Lemmy getting filled with shills, or are people THAT clueless? Has the pandemic suddenly affected our long term memory or something?)
How can you not know about this? Seriously!
Yes, I’m aware. Fediverse also has nazis, they’re everywhere. I can put on my big boy pants and block them as I see them, instead of an admin doing collateral damage and preventing from talking to all the other people who won’t leave Threads.
Okay first, you have no fucking idea how online harassment works. I’ve seen numerous cases of people being attacked, even doxxed, hy hordes of assholes. Imagine a single mother who can barely have time to work and attend their children, to deal with this shit. And you know? It happens ALL THE TIME to BIPOC users on the fedi.
“Hey, the nazis are invading Poland, why aren’t you on the frontlines carrying your gun?” As if there wasn no such thing as innocent CIVILIANS. In a world where speaking up is punished by dogpiling, harassing and doxxing, people just prefer to flee because their admins don’t do shit to defend them. Ask ANY Black person on Mastodon what it’s like to be harassed online.
Second, forcing people deal with the problems of harassment puts the burden of blocking on the end user. (From another POV, it’s the e-mail spam problem if you think about it. Dogpiling is a social form of DDOSing someone, and there’s no way to prevent it except by mass blocking the source of the attacks.
Letting an instance admin defederate from a problematic instance protects ALL the admin’s users with minimal effort on their part. If a threads user is defederated they can as well switch to another instance, nobody stops them.
Are they not happy with how their instance is treated? Demand changes to the instance, after all they paid for it, didn’t they? Oh they didn’t? Then who’s finacing and controlling it then?
Consider defederation the invisible hand of the market turned visible.
Defederation is NOT damage. On the other hand, people suffering emotional distress from harassment IS damage.