I’m using LineageOS. I wasn’t quite sure whether it’s what I want to stick with long term for various reasons, but during the roulette of alternative phone OS, it’s what my choice to try first fell on.
I hope there will be other, better options as well.
how does the article not even mention graphene too?
or any other
Here’s the real thing. Without custom ROM you are not only at Google’s mercy but at the mercy of the carrier, who gets paid to install loads of junk you can’t remove. Adware and surveillance is the goal here, and the ability to remove it is the target.
You can always buy your hardware.
From who? I’d really love to know as I’ve tried.Motorola direct purchases come with junk installed you can’t remove. Samsung direct, even worse. Ironically Google has the cleanest Android image. Fairphone et al. aren’t available in the US as far as I know.
This is not true at least here. There are no vendor locked phones AFAIK. Idk why, maybe another EU boss move. You need to start regulating this shit across the pond.
Gonna save You a click:
“LineageOS says Google’s new developer verification system will not affect devices running its custom ROM.”
ZebraGoose? More like ZebraGOAT
Thanks for your service
*directly
Several projects have already announced sunsetting in light of this announcement. It’s hard to predict what will come of even major projects like F-Droid, but there will absolutely be a major cooling effect on the entire platform.
But why? As far as I know these projects make money from donations and surely the people that donate would have a custom ROM or root, speaking of which, there are app installers that work with Shizuku
There’s been app whose developers stopped after no longer being able to publish to the Google Play Store, even though they also published to F-Droid.
I don’t know why, but the “cooling effect” is certainly real.
Yep. In some cases, Google play sales subsidize FOSS users. In other cases, if the user count is not high enough through all sources, it’s just not worth it for the devs to keep working on a niche project. F-Droid users are a tiny fraction of users, and ROM users are a fraction of F-Droid users.
The sun always sets. But which projects are shutting down?
Any Android custom ROM basically.
The funny thing is this will kill the premium android phone market harder than any other move Google could make.
Incompetent losers, Google is such a massive waste of resources.
I do not understand this statement.
You mean if it’s not possible to easily sideload apps, people won’t buy premium android phones?
Because if that’s the reason, iPhones would be a massive failure.
If everyone in the world was like me and you, yes, the most popular phone would be the fairphone and maybe they would even sell it with a Linux ROM, while iPhones and other phones with locked bootloaders would be impossible to sell even at 95% discount, but we account for the 0.0001%
Installing any apps I want is the only reason I’m on android, if I have to suck it up and bend over backwards for my phone company, I’d buy apple, it’s a much better phone most of the time, better build quality, lasts a few more years both hardware level and security update level.
I mean I’m not switching, but some family members who rely on me for advice on what phone to buy, I don’t think I can recommend android in good faith.
Yes but ther’s dozens of us…
I feel like you’re overestimating the number of people who buy a Google or Samsung device because they want to install third party apps. A lot of them buy an Android device because they just don’t like Apple. Most folks don’t install anything from anywhere other than the Play Store because they don’t even know there are other choices.
In general, people’s preferences are most often born from whatever their first device was, and nothing more, with little interest in what they can do with it other than what’s required of them.
This won’t even dent the premium phone market.
People are too fucking stupid. Honestly, why even bother if we’re a small fraction of the community.
almost nobody i know irl installs apps outside google play through direct APK installs (or f-droid)
I run custom apps so its going to slow me down a little having to go through the google dev stuff now. Ive already got a account, I just hope it doesnt slow down the testing phase of the projects.
I wish that were true. But most consumers buy a phone based on a few metrics - the screen (large, bright, vibrant), fast CPU/GPU (mobile gamers), cameras, storage capacity, software support longevity, battery life, general bling (colors, shiny), and pre-chosen platform/cult (Android, iOS).
Techies like us care. But we’re very much the exception, not the rule.
And if sideloading can be unlocked and available after a 24-hour wait - as Google suggests - then it’ll matter even less.
Frankly most consumers only consider screen size from specs, brand and price (not value necessarily).
This isn’t going to move the needle at all. Most normal people don’t give a shit, and unfortunately the normal people out number us by a lot.
there’s also chinese phone users…
they’re not great since those also have locked bootloader though
Tech sucks now. Nothing I own is truly mine anymore. And things are getting more and more locked into vendor platforms where you actually rent stuff instead of own stuff
Claw it back.
Yes. Provided you find a phone that can unlock the bootloader and you are fine in losing banking app, government issued apps and such amenities…
Given that Samsung and Xiaomi doesn’t let you unlock anymore… Unless you are ok giving money to Google to buy a pixel, new or used, there are really little choices currently. Nothing phones, a few motorola (hit and miss…).
For example, we have digital ID that you can load on the phone your ID card and driving license, which is not allowed on unlocked phones. Also, McDonald app doesn’t work on unlocked phones …
So good luck hoping people will use custom Roms, even less than before. Google is fucking us a small step a time.
I have my banking apps on here, though it requires the compromise of also installing the google services shit. Everything I can get through F-Droid, I do. I’ll have to keep an eye on other, manually sideloaded apps though.
For example, we have digital ID that you can load on the phone your ID card and driving license, which is not allowed on unlocked phones.
Yeah that’s a problem, one only you and your government can fix, but it is indeed an issue.
Also, McDonald app doesn’t work on unlocked phones …
My brother the McDonald app is spyware, it only exists to sell your data to brokers who sell it to advertisers and the NSA. If you’re just going to install spyware anyway there’s no purpose to switch to a custom ROM. Is all your message data, files, etc, really worth $1.00 off a McChicken?
It’s easy enough to work around most of it, with web apps. You can even install them to have separate icons. Granted, there are some things that are impossible, like digital ID, but there aren’t any that fundamentally affect phone usability, for my personal use.
What’s holding me up is work stuff. I get a stipend to have a work phone, so I just use my personal device, but I’m getting a separate device for work soon so I can cut out everything Google/Microsoft on me personal device. Digital control and privacy matters.
No. You cannot. The digital id I was referring to can be activated only via app, and banking apps are mandatory. You can do web banking paying an additional fee and using sms authentication, but as I said it’s an additional fee. Maybe worth paying for, ymmv.
But the real practical of the digital id is that I will never be (again) fined for driving without a driving license with me because I always have my phone with me. I usually have also my real driving license, but sometimes I leave the wallet home or whatever.
It’s just practical stuff, you can do without, but why should I.
What banks charge fees for web banking!? That doesn’t make a lick of sense, imho… That incentivizes using much-more-expensive in-person banking.
Also, even if there are some banks that don’t have web banking, it’s easy enough to switch banks (at least, in the countries I know about). Some people even regularly cycle through institutions to get sign-on bonuses a couple times each year.
But, yes. It’s less convenient to use platforms that respect privacy, and requires some trade-offs.
They incentivize using the app not the web banking thus they can track u more.
What digital ID app are you talking about? Only one I could find references of online was “DigiLocker”
It’s called IO
Just lock the bootloader again? I don’t have Google on my Android and can use banking apps and most others that don’t have a hard requirements on some Google API.
Most phones can’t even relock the bootloader. And newer Samsung ones can’t even get flashed. Recent updates removed even the ability to flash a custom recovery
Vote with your wallets. You don’t own your Samsung devices.
Its not much of a vote if they change the conditions after casting it. I was on a note 10+ running lineageos just fine, got the opportunity to “upgrade” to this s22 ultra for free, and got screwed over by Samsung not even a month later
so you’re selling your right to privacy and choice for the convenience of a…banking app?
you sound like a cheap date. wanna go grab some food from the dumpsters behind Arby’s?
Please don’t underestimate how fucked “modern” citizens are. Privacy is no longer an easy choice.
You might see a banking app (including phone-based payments, using the phone as a card or using a payment app) as mere convenience, and to a large degree it is, but aside from that there are also national ID apps that are simply impossible to live without in some EU countries. There are exceptions for seniors and disabled folk, but even they miss out on some critical social access that’s just not realistic for eg. parents of school-age children.
the day I have to have a phone for an ID is the day I stop having a cellphone.
I already get wild looks when I tell people I don’t have a Facebook. I can only imagine their heads exploding when I say I don’t have a phone.
Sure, you can not have a cell phone. Then you also can’t communicate with your kids’ teachers, or receive communication from them. Which will have… other consequences.
Then you also can’t communicate with your kids’ teachers, or receive communication from them.
already there. I either talk to them directly or email them. no biggie.
Well, seems I am not a privacy freak and I like to live my life as I see fit. Yet, my back knows everything about my life already so
it has nothing to do with your bank and everything to do with the company your bank used to whitelabel their app.
most banking apps are from a handful of companies. those companies scrape you for as much data as they can and sell it to other companies.
things like, balance, location, proximity to points of interest, length of time spent in points of interest, etc.
so you might be thinking you’re just in bed with your bank, but your bank turned out the lights and has a camera streaming your private information to the highest bidder.
Well, thank you for letting me know, I guess my data is the price for that commodity.
At the end of the day life is one and there are other hills I am willing to die on rather than this one.
I’d rather not be able to have a digital ID on my phone if I have to allow a company full access to scan my stuff, how do I know they won’t delete my ID at some point and just say it is what it is?
Can you still install Lineage OS on a flagship modern phone?
A lot of them don’t even let you unlock the bootloader anymore. Definitely getting harder to find one that let you.
Calyx on a Fairphone 6 perhaps ? allows you to lock and unlock the bootloader for anal apps that need it
You’d need to check for a specific device in their wiki but I’d be rare if they don’t support ir or that they aren’t working to port it to a device
Oddly I’m yet to own a device they do support.
I suppose it’s mostly my fault as I’ve not proactively searched before purchasing.
If you own a Samsung Galaxy the supported devices are pretty grim.
if you can unlock the phone, you can install a treble GSI build of lineageos
I must look this up. I’m fairly certain the phone is easily unlocked.
That’s odd, I can remember back in my day that Samsung-s were like the first thing they poked with because pretty much everyone used Samsung phones. Maybe they did something to their bootloader or something…?
I won’t blame you for not knowing, though, but now that the writing is on the wall, better be sure before buying another phone about compatibility for third party OSes, if not one that comes with one already installed
Samsung no longer has unlock able boot AFAIK
Yes absolutely 👍
I’m also courting the idea of using a Sailfish OS phone.
Yeah you really need to check the Wiki before shopping. OnePlus is a pretty good choice. That’s what I had until switching to GrapheneOS (Pixel devices only for now, something from Moto next year).
I run it on my Oneplus 12, a couple years omd but I’d consider it a modern flagship.
I’m very happy with the compromise offered by LineageOS between a Googled phone and a free OS. LineageOS support was a hard requirement for me while choosing my current phone.
What about huawei phones?
They don’t run Android but their own custom OS.
Their own made-in-house alternate custom-os I’d like to specify, incompatible with android apks as of the latest
I thought they could use apks with some level of emulation… I’m so fucking mad about this Google last move. Most of the apss I use are from fdroid.
Annoying, but it’s a once only thing to have to wait 24 hours, as soon as they bring this in, I’ll try and install something I don’t need immediately to start the process, then I’m ready to install stuff when I need it.
Is it a slippery slope? I hope not.
It’s my phone, I don’t have to ask for Google’s permission, AND wait 24 hours for their approval. It’s not a slippery slope if the shit we predicted happened already.
Is it a slippery slope? I hope not.
When you buy a device you fucking own it. Not Google. Not anyone else. I don’t need permission from Google to do what I want, with the device I own.
Seriously folks. Google set out to solve the problem of scammers tricking normies into installing malicious apps, and they found a solution that both does that and barely inconveniences power users. It’s an ideal and elegant solution that they arrived at after soliciting user feedback and listening to it. What more do you want from them?
Could this have been way worse? Absolutely. Will they try something worse in the future? Absolutely. They probably only chose this solution because so many of us provided feedback and pushback. But take the win and fight a different battle. There are so many problems and attacks on ownership privacy and freedom right now, so stop wasting your effort on the one fight we already won.
Maybe they should spend a little time and money hiring people to vet developers instead of this bullshit. It’s about control, not safety. Everything is going app-based, and they want data tracking, so if people side step their means of hoarding data, they’re upset and going to block this ability.
Think about it: those who sideload are typically the power users who know what they’re installing in the first place. The fact they’re talking about cracking down on app stores and devs is shit. Vet the code and look at what the app is doing with users’ data. Idk, but is a not great solution.
The Apple app store with all it’s control was supposed to stop malicious apps and scammers and it didn’t do fuck all. This won’t be any different. As the person below me said its about control and data, thats what they want and this is the sugared poison step they’re starting with.
Seriously folks. Google set out to solve the problem of scammers tricking normies into installing malicious apps
That must be why I can’t find malware in the play store, right?
RIGHT?!?!
Two, if you count users who have never sideloaded anything and never will.
Edit: It seems some of you are absolutely livid about the fact that normal, non-tech minded people exist.
Never will because they won’t be allowed in a year or two?
Never will because they’re too scared of computers to step one toe outside of the walled garden. It’s a surprisingly big part of android users, according to my personal evidence
It’s a surprisingly big part of android users, according to my personal evidence
It’s 99.9% of users. The overwhelming vast majority of users know absolutely nothing about apps from anywhere but the built in store and don’t care to look.
Which begs the question of why they bother with us.
