That’s because the Chinese government is heavily subsidizing EVs, explicitly to monopolize global EV and battery manufacturing. The US reaction isn’t great. Instead we should be doing the same. Our EV’s should only cost $15K because ford gets paid $30K by the government for each one they make.
That’s because the Chinese government is heavily subsidizing EVs
What are the subsidy rates on these vehicles? How much should the market value of a Seagull be?
Our EV’s should only cost $15K because ford gets paid $30K by the government
Do you honestly believe these compact Chinese EVs cost $45k/ea to make, when they’re less than half the size of an American Sedan and with far less administrative overhead?
Seems like you missed something there, op didn’t mention how much the China models actually cost. Only that they’re subsidized and that we should also subsidize
They claimed the vehicle was subsidized without pointing to any subsidies.
In the US, you can at least put your finger on the $7500 EV tax credit. With China, its just a bunch of handwaving mixed with incredulity that vehicles can be produced so cheaply.
Subsidizing costs can come in a number of ways. Not just to customers at the point of sale. They could have subsidized labor, materials, patent licensing, and tax breaks. All artificially lowering production costs, to lower prices, to create a Chinese dominant position in the global EV market. Because we know that’s what the Chinese government wants. That’s what the “Belt and Road Initiative” is.
They could have subsidized labor, materials, patent licensing, and tax breaks.
You can play this game in any country by pointing to the publicly available infrastructure and utilities. China having a cheap, robust education and transportation system with low cost public utilities and an efficient legal bureaucracy isn’t a subsidy, its an efficiency.
that’s what the Chinese government wants
That’s what every country wants. You think the Germans and the Brits don’t want Volkswagons or Aston Martins to be the dominant global automotive brand?
That’s what the “Belt and Road Initiative” is.
Claiming the BRI as a subsidy is exactly what I’m talking about. They’re building value-add infrastructure to reduce the natural economic friction of trade and travel. That’s a material improvement to the market, not a state-sponsored loss per unit of production.
China having a cheap, robust education and transportation system with low cost public utilities and an efficient legal bureaucracy isn’t a subsidy, its an efficiency.
None of those are subsidies, or what I ment.
That’s what every country wants. You think the Germans and the Brits don’t want Volkswagons or Aston Martins to be the dominant global automotive brand?
No. They’re certainly not acting like it. Not doing anything serous to support that goal.
Claiming the BRI as a subsidy
Not what I did. It’s an economic global power play, to replace the US and USD as “The” world power. Subsidies are just part of the plan.
You keep mentioning things as if I was talking about them first.
Who are you supposed to be responding to? Are you having multiple conversions and getting us mixed up.
Idk if you can compare a Civic with an Accord and call the $4000 difference a subsidy.
But if we’re being generous and ignoring the Euro/USD currency spread, you’re still talking about a $7000 subsidy. Roughly what Americans give out in EV credits. Except its for a car that’s still cheaper than its American equivalent.
That’s before you get into the amenities provided by Chinese municipalities, the lower cost of living, and the business friendly attitude of the current government.
That’s because the Chinese government is heavily subsidizing EVs, explicitly to monopolize global EV and battery manufacturing. The US reaction isn’t great. Instead we should be doing the same. Our EV’s should only cost $15K because ford gets paid $30K by the government for each one they make.
What are the subsidy rates on these vehicles? How much should the market value of a Seagull be?
Do you honestly believe these compact Chinese EVs cost $45k/ea to make, when they’re less than half the size of an American Sedan and with far less administrative overhead?
Seems like you missed something there, op didn’t mention how much the China models actually cost. Only that they’re subsidized and that we should also subsidize
They claimed the vehicle was subsidized without pointing to any subsidies.
In the US, you can at least put your finger on the $7500 EV tax credit. With China, its just a bunch of handwaving mixed with incredulity that vehicles can be produced so cheaply.
Subsidizing costs can come in a number of ways. Not just to customers at the point of sale. They could have subsidized labor, materials, patent licensing, and tax breaks. All artificially lowering production costs, to lower prices, to create a Chinese dominant position in the global EV market. Because we know that’s what the Chinese government wants. That’s what the “Belt and Road Initiative” is.
You can play this game in any country by pointing to the publicly available infrastructure and utilities. China having a cheap, robust education and transportation system with low cost public utilities and an efficient legal bureaucracy isn’t a subsidy, its an efficiency.
That’s what every country wants. You think the Germans and the Brits don’t want Volkswagons or Aston Martins to be the dominant global automotive brand?
Claiming the BRI as a subsidy is exactly what I’m talking about. They’re building value-add infrastructure to reduce the natural economic friction of trade and travel. That’s a material improvement to the market, not a state-sponsored loss per unit of production.
None of those are subsidies, or what I ment.
No. They’re certainly not acting like it. Not doing anything serous to support that goal.
Not what I did. It’s an economic global power play, to replace the US and USD as “The” world power. Subsidies are just part of the plan.
Building interasiatic high speed rail is no more a power play than digging the Panama Canal or building up the Singapore port network.
These are material improvements to international trade and travel. You’re describing them like some kind of corporate bust out.
You keep mentioning things as if I was talking about them first.
Who are you supposed to be responding to? Are you having multiple conversions and getting us mixed up.
I’m Europe, the BYD Dolphin starts at 23k Euros, so that’s probably pretty close to the nonsubsidized price.
Idk if you can compare a Civic with an Accord and call the $4000 difference a subsidy.
But if we’re being generous and ignoring the Euro/USD currency spread, you’re still talking about a $7000 subsidy. Roughly what Americans give out in EV credits. Except its for a car that’s still cheaper than its American equivalent.
In addition to subsidies, part of the reason the Chinese EVs cost so little is due to how much less workers are paid there.
That’s before you get into the amenities provided by Chinese municipalities, the lower cost of living, and the business friendly attitude of the current government.
American companies would just raise the price of the cars. China also has price control.
Probably true